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Something to Add To Upvote/Downvote/Like: Huh?

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SaucyMouse
12 hours ago, Sniperi96 said:

Getting downvoted on single post and getting spam-downvoted on multiple posts just because you got picked by someone are two very different things.

I think everyone have rights to downvote every post they (strongly) disagree with but when the downvoting is done just to systematically affect one player's reputation, without even reading posts,  is where I would think the line of what can be considered good taste is grossed  especially if, as mentioned in the thread, the person is using multiple accounts(thing that itself is against terms of use).

That being said, I'm not really taking any side on this thread and stay behind what I wrote 10 days ago.

 

 

Which is why I stated her doing so is fine in my comment from which you quoted. I also said in that same post that whom ever is targeting her is a Grade-A donkey-hat, but we don't even know for certain it's trolling as some of her posts that were down-voted deserved so since it's basically her being offensive and/or arguing with people and that would get whoever she has commented with to down-vote her. That is why I did my research before posting the comment. Trust me my original draft before posting was a bit more controversial and was leaning more to an attack to who might be trolling.

 

She has obviously taken a break perhaps to get away from this drama until it cools down. You know all of this might even be related to her post she made here about downplaying bullying only because she has gone through worse. She said, and I quote, "That's the thing though. Can we really equate downvoting to bullying? To me that seems like a really wild interpretation."  and then later on continued with "Well, looks like someone just went on a downvote spree on me, almost as if to prove a point. But you know what? I still refuse to call it bullying." She then accuses Rob in which he ignored or corrected her via PM, who knows? Besides them. But it seems this is when the attack began. The only way to beat a troll is to ignore them but we keep giving them this attention and this has basically become his/her own personal fanpage since we keep talking about them, so let's just drop this topic all together and move on until they get bored.

 

-Just call me Mousy Drew because I solve things and stuff.

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Sniperi96
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, SaucyMouse said:

 

Which is why I stated her doing so is fine in my comment from which you quoted. I also said in that same post that whom ever is targeting her is a Grade-A donkey-hat, but we don't even know for certain it's trolling as some of her posts that were down-voted deserved so since it's basically her being offensive and/or arguing with people and that would get whoever she has commented with to down-vote her. That is why I did my research before posting the comment. Trust me my original draft before posting was a bit more controversial and was leaning more to an attack to who might be trolling.

Were they? I think I need especially part were Sakura has been offensive, because no matter how I look at her posts, I found it really hard to find to hard find any of her posts offensive. Could you kindly point out these parts?

Arguing is not a bad thing.I repeat,arguing is not bad thing. As university student, if I'm being told that we have to stay behind one opinion or be against it basing on how majority thinks, I say that at that point we have lost all the base for constructive discussion. Arguing is not targeted towards person nor should it be based on personal feelings towards that person. In nutshell it is putting forth reasons for or against something. If done right, it can point out things that need to be considered about the subject and open discussion on them.

That being said, I think it's fair to say rarely, especially on forums like this does this principle succeed. People are just too keen on their own personal opinions instead of looking on bigger picture in front of them. And more often than not do these "debates" end up in other way than going against the person who has presented their argument instead of the argument itself, sadly.

I need to stress that I don't thinkanyone should "deserve" downvotes in other of their thread just basing on how people feel personally towards them. I think you should downvote basing on the indivual post and not search for what the person has said/done in the past.

Edited by Sniperi96
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SaucyMouse
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Sniperi96 said:

Were they? I think I need especially part were Sakura has been offensive, because no matter how I look at her posts, I found it really hard to find to hard find any of her posts offensive. Could you kindly point out these parts?

 

Look for yourself I don't want to draw attention to any of those posts just in case this person(s) hasn't seen it yet and wants to take it further, or if they haven't targeted those posts as I am not sure which these posts were down-voted or by whom or even when they got voted on just what I saw and what I came up with. I could easily be far from the truth but it's a theory. Just look for any comments that have the red icon and click to find out what's being said. There are some that are just random and have no reason to be down-voted (or even up-voted mind you it might just be someone trying to counter the down-votes honestly.)

 

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Arguing is not a bad thing.I repeat,arguing is not bad ********* university student, if I'm being told that we have to stay behind one opinion or be against it basing on how majority thinks, I say that at that point we have lost all the base for constructive discussion. Arguing is not targeted towards person nor should it be based on personal feelings towards that ********** nutshell it is putting forth reasons for or against something. If done ********* can point out things that need to be considered about the subject and open discussion on them.

 

Don't confuse debating with arguing two very different ways of communication as where debating is done in a more intellectual and formal way as opposed to arguing where it can lead to a hostile environment due to it becoming personal e.g personal opinions as opposed to facts.  You and I are debating no personal attacks and everything is formal as opposed to informal and insulting.

 

If you argue with someone and make that person feel stupid then that's where it can take an ugly turn. You don't even need to say the person is stupid. if you insinuate it as if the knowledge is "common sense" or they brought up a "trivial topic" especially to someone who is new you can come off as sour or rude. People need to understand new players come and go all the time and they will have questions or make suggestions that have been said before or unique but that doesn't mean to bombard them negative feedback or make snide comments.


 

Quote

That being said, I think it's fair to say rarely, especially on forums like this does this principle succeed. People are just too keen on their own personal opinions instead of looking on bigger picture in front of them. And more often than not do these "debates" end up in other way than going against the person who has presented their argument instead of the argument itself, sadly.

 

Agreed.

 

Quote

I need to stress that I don't thinkanyone should "deserve" downvotes in other of their thread just basing on how people feel personally towards them. I think you should downvote basing on the indivual post and not search for what the person has said/done in the past.

 

I only researched as I don't know much about her seeing as I am fairly new to the forums myself. My intention was not to judge her but to come to a conclusion or theory on why this may or may not be happening to her.  I also expressed no one deserves to be treated like this but it's happening apparently and as someone who watches too many shows like Elementary and HTGAWM I tend to snoop.

 

 

- Just call me Snoop Moussy

Edited by SaucyMouse
we can say stupid but not d_u_m_b?
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Otakutron
12 hours ago, SaucyMouse said:

If you argue with someone and make that person feel stupid then that's where it can take an ugly turn.

 

Shouldn't the criteria be something other than a person's feelings?  Feelings can be influenced by how well you slept, how well you've been eating, stress from family or school or work, and many other factors.

 

So, I went through Sakura's recent posts that had any Downvotes.  The short version is, if she disagrees with Rob Ratt, she gets hit.  If she agrees with me, she gets hit.  At worst, some of her posts were curt, but they were in response to comments I thought were themselves pushing the bounds of what is allowed.

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AlexGoneCrazy
4 hours ago, Otakutron said:

 

Shouldn't the criteria be something other than a person's feelings?  Feelings can be influenced by how well you slept, how well you've been eating, stress from family or school or work, and many other factors.

 

So, I went through Sakura's recent posts that had any Downvotes.  The short version is, if she disagrees with Rob Ratt, she gets hit.  If she agrees with me, she gets hit.  At worst, some of her posts were curt, but they were in response to comments I thought were themselves pushing the bounds of what is allowed.

 

Do you know what board you are on? This isn't reddit or some forum in the steam store there is a huge player base of children and as children are prone to be a bit more sensitive, then you have to think about their feelings whether you want to or not. The bunch of you think every child in this board is non existent or should man up and grow hair on their chest and stop being children just so you can feel secure enough to belittle or be condescending to them.

 

Also I did what @SaucyMouse said which was go through her comments and it took me a while to find one that was a perfect example of getting on someone's bad side and her being out of line and disrespectful. She flat out called someone an idiot. And sorry @SaucyMouse I know you said you didnt want attention going to her posts just to avoid feeding the troll but these people are either tunnel visioning because they're her fans, friends or what have you or don't want to bother looking, but either way its most likely this dude read all of them already anyway.

 

https://forums.pokemontcg.com/topic/69231-please-help-me/?tab=comments#comment-617485

 

A link for those who look for a tv remote by sitting down and calling for it expecting it to call back and let you know where it is. 🙄 Also I know she is talking to someone who isn't doing themselves any favors by how they are talking but you dont go around calling people idiots period.

 

Some of her other comments were either not important or barely callous enough that I'm sure her fans would run to her defense anyway no matter what.

 

And if you still think otherwise just remember for the 100th time this is a family friendly game and a family friendly forum or at least its supposed to be.

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Sniperi96
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, AlexGoneCrazy said:

Also I did what @SaucyMouse said which was go through her comments and it took me a while to find one that was a perfect example of getting on someone's bad side and her being out of line and disrespectful. She flat out called someone an idiot. And sorry @SaucyMouse I know you said you didnt want attention going to her posts just to avoid feeding the troll but these people are either tunnel visioning because they're her fans, friends or what have you or don't want to bother looking, but either way its most likely this dude read all of them already anyway.

 

https://forums.pokemontcg.com/topic/69231-please-help-me/?tab=comments#comment-617485

 

A link for those who look for a tv remote by sitting down and calling for it expecting it to call back and let you know where it is. 🙄 Also I know she is talking to someone who isn't doing themselves any favors by how they are talking but you dont go around calling people idiots period.

No, I wouldn't say I just sat down, but looking from 2105 posts, when you have no idea even about when it was posted is not something I would spend my time on. And usually it goes "innicent until proven quilty", so even then I would expect the ones who are claiming she has been offensive to show evidence for that.

That being said, If you really need to forcebly search for individual post to show the person has been offensive  half year ago, in context that the post currently (11.45 +2 CET, 26th June 2019) has even positive upvote/downvote ratio (4/3) and that it had been targeted towards person who kept spamming their thread over and over again, I think we are on little wobbly grounds.

I'm not saying that calling anyone idiot is acceptable, but neither would I judge her other posts just basing on that post, nor would I start downvote her posts just to decrease her reputation.

Edited by Sniperi96
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Sniperi96
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, SaucyMouse said:

Don't confuse debating with arguing two very different ways of communication as where debating is done in a more intellectual and formal way as opposed to arguing where it can lead to a hostile environment due to it becoming personal e.g personal opinions as opposed to facts.  You and I are debating no personal attacks and everything is formal as opposed to informal and insulting.

No, actually you can use both of intellectual and formal way to give thoughts. Especially in academic papers arguing is used extensively to present one's thoughts eg. "I argue that...." or "person argues that..." and the word is based on word argument, word which Wikipedia descibes as:

Quote

In logic and philosophy, an argument is an attempt to persuade someone of something, or give evidence or reasons for accepting a particular conclusion.

In debates the particpants are arguing. However, in common language the term to argue has many negative forms, just as you descibed along the intellectual form I descibed. The fallacies are what pushes the debate on wrong rails and lead to the undesired consequences. For instance Ad hominem fallacy is attacking against person, rather than the argument.

Edited by Sniperi96
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DuskDarkVoid
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Sniperi96 said:

No, I wouldn't say I just sat down, but looking from 2105 posts, when you have no idea even about when it was posted is not something I would spend my time on. And usually it goes "innicent until proven quilty", so even then I would expect the ones who are claiming she has been offensive to show evidence for that.

That being said, If you really need to forcebly search for individual post to show the person has been offensive  half year ago, in context that the post currently (11.45 +2 CET, 26th June 2019) has even positive upvote/downvote ratio (4/3) and that it had been targeted towards person who kept spamming their thread over and over again, I think we are on little wobbly grounds.

I'm not saying that calling anyone idiot is acceptable, but neither would I judge her other posts just basing on that post, nor would I start downvote her posts just to decrease her reputation.

 

I'm just going to pm my response because this is no longer about the OP's topic and has carried out to be about trolls and the downvote of some random user. Seriously the mods should just close this thread now.
 

In addition I would also like to see what Robert said about removing the voting system all together aside from positive reactions.

Edited by DuskDarkVoid
Added what I wanted to say originally
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AlexGoneCrazy
1 hour ago, Sniperi96 said:

No, I wouldn't say I just sat down, but looking from 2105 posts, when you have no idea even about when it was posted is not something I would spend my time on. And usually it goes "innicent until proven quilty", so even then I would expect the ones who are claiming she has been offensive to show evidence for that.

That being said, If you really need to forcebly search for individual post to show the person has been offensive  half year ago, in context that the post currently (11.45 +2 CET, 26th June 2019) has even positive upvote/downvote ratio (4/3) and that it had been targeted towards person who kept spamming their thread over and over again, I think we are on little wobbly grounds.

I'm not saying that calling anyone idiot is acceptable, but neither would I judge her other posts just basing on that post, nor would I start downvote her posts just to decrease her reputation.

And neither would I but everyone wanted "proof" and since Mousy sauce said she did "research" to come up with some outlandish theory about some lame troll I decided to look for myself. It took me about 5-10 minutes of reading and looking and I almost gave up until I found that one. I didn't look at the date honestly and honestly dont care when it was posted it literally was the only post I personally found offensive enough to warrant an attack. Honestly I didn't even know she was being trolled until this thread about 20 minutes prior to my initial posting in this thread. Plus her rep count looks normal from when I last saw it about 2 weeks ago.

 

If people are crying about the measly few downvotes in this thread alone let me remind you I was attacked the same way in my thread that got a stupid amount of heat just for not being super boring and serious. Even on posts that said "thank you" got hit and since then I decided I'd rather invest my time on creating a personal map for my own server in ARK because at least there people are a bit more friendly.

 

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Otakutron
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, AlexGoneCrazy said:

Do you know what board you are on? This isn't reddit or some forum in the steam store there is a huge player base of children and as children are prone to be a bit more sensitive, then you have to think about their feelings whether you want to or not. The bunch of you think every child in this board is non existent or should man up and grow hair on their chest and stop being children just so you can feel secure enough to belittle or be condescending to them.

 

A person's emotional reaction alone should not be the basis for policy, because there are many factors that influence emotions - including age - and those factors can cause someone to respond differently to the same stimulus. If we just go by emotional responses, great, both you and I get banned.  I know I've offended some folks here and I know you've offended me multiple times. ;)

 

The rest of what I quoted is a strawman attack.  Seems like a hypocritical one as well.  You are belittling and condescending not only me... but actual young forum users.  Because they can behave, and those that can't need to learn.  That is what growing up is about.  If I'm mean to some kid when I shouldn't be, that ain't right, but it also ain't the issue at hand.

 

9 hours ago, AlexGoneCrazy said:

Also I did what @SaucyMouse said which was go through her comments and it took me a while to find one that was a perfect example of getting on someone's bad side and her being out of line and disrespectful. She flat out called someone an idiot.

 

I'm not sure you understand what was being discussed.  @Sakura150612 has received a decent amount of Downvotes lately, but she doesn't usually let it bother her.  It was only worth mentioning because of this specific thread.  @SaucyMouse claimed it was because of "rude" posts.  I found a few comments that might be curt, but were still more polite than was deserved by the subject of the response.  You dug even deeper and only managed to find one post from six months ago and, given the context, I'm still not sure it was actually rude.

 

Which leads me to believe the downvotes she received were due to people disagreeing with her, and that isn't a problem if it is.  Keep in mind, while I checked about a dozen comments, there were no egregious examples like "I explained a ruling to someone, the ruling was correct, but now it has five downvotes." or "I posted a trade offer that was fair.  It now has three downvotes." etc.

 

5 hours ago, AlexGoneCrazy said:

If people are crying about the measly few downvotes in this thread alone let me remind you I was attacked the same way in my thread that got a stupid amount of heat just for not being super boring and serious. Even on posts that said "thank you" got hit and since then I decided I'd rather invest my time on creating a personal map for my own server in ARK because at least there people are a bit more friendly.

 

The people "crying" about such things are RobRatt and SaucyMouse, not Sakura.  Interesting you described it that way.  Based on her own words, Sakura was irritated because people were calling a Downvoting "bullying".  She felt that demeaned the bullying she had experienced in her own life and those of others.  While dealing with emotions, she still tried to make a logical case... but if feelings are supposed to be the authority for board rules, then she can't be challenged on her feelings, can she? ;)

 

You've been pretty rude on these boards, at least by my standards.  Not by your own, however, so you feel like the victim.  I recall the thread where you posted a rant in Game Feedback, and once you caught some flack for it, claimed it was a joke.  Whether the original post was serious or intended as a joke was in the wrong subforum.  Even if it had been posted to the correct forum and wasn't serious, it also wasn't funny.  I think it was one of your earliest posts. Thus, even if it had been funny, no one knew you well enough for it to really work as humor.

 

The worst thing anyone on these boards could do to another user, at least, while obeying the forum rules, is to encourage you to do such things.  The second worst is to sit by and let you do them without warning you that you're giving folks more and more reason to just pretend you don't exist and ignore (or Ignore) all your posts.

Edited by Otakutron
Work in process; got to clean up the "Oh, guess that word is censored even though it isn't profane" asterisks. ;)

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RobRatt

@Moderators,

 

This thread has devolved into an ugly little monster.  Please consider closing it.  Nothing new or substantial is being added as Feedback to The Pokémon Company.  My personal hope is that one of you sees this, is able to get past the rancor, and will pass along any fair/decent suggestions.

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Mod_Jynthu

Hello Trainers,

 

Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the Upvote/Downvote/Like system. This thread has gotten off topic and is no longer constructive. I recommend that everyone take the time to review the forum rules.

 

I understand that some Trainers are receiving downvotes on numerous posts and feel that they have been targeted by another Trainer or multiple Trainers. I will be reviewing this further and keeping an eye out for this behavior in the future.

 

I have closed this thread at this time.

 

 

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