Jump to content
Scarlet_Thunder

Can't Beat Zach

Recommended Posts

Otakutron
23 hours ago, Wcndave said:

Good example just now.  Trainer uses Ludicolo uses captivating rhythm to put in my weakest PM, then uses a benched card, I think it was victreebel, to poison and confuse, from the bench, and then Ludicolo comes with solar ray, does 80 damage, and heals itself.

 

I can't really see what defense I have at my disposal when I cannot attack, at all, they self heal, and if I get a good card in, they can just swap it out.  And then confuse it....

 

I just have to hope, to luck, that this combo doesn't come up before I've already won...

 

That is a good example... of either really bad luck on your end, really good luck on the opponent's end, or just that you're still learning.  Maybe a little bit of each, because you just described what you thought was an "ultimate combo!" and... it isn't even close.  Possibly because you left some information out, but let me run through what we do know to explain why.

 

First, some general tips:

  • Prize card counts are a lousy way to tell who is winning in Pokémon, except when a player has taken their final Prize.  Worry about the board just as much, if not more.
  • Know that most cards aren't going to prove worthwhile in competitive play.  Yeah, those other TCG's are the same, though some hide it better than others, or consider it a feature that you have to work out what is good, what isn't, and can try to find a use even for the "bad" cards. XD
  • Some numbers matter and some don't.  Healing damage taken or increasing damage done only matter if they change how many turns it takes for a KO to happen, other than triggering certain card effects.
  • Most attack effects and all Special Conditions go away if you bounce, retreat, or evolve the afflicted Pokémon.  A deck may also contain cards that specifically remove them as well.
  • You can risk attacking while Confused.  The odds are even that the attack will work or backfire.

The combo you described isn't actually that good, even though it seems so formidable in the Trainer Challenge, with decks you haven't fully unlocked.  Building a Stage 2 on your Bench isn't easy.  Building up two of them is hard, and if one has to be built while it is Active, it is almost impossible... at least, under normal Theme, Standard, Expanded, or Legacy Format play.  So I'm guessing you were already struggling before this happened; it should have taken three or four turns where you either couldn't attack or couldn't attack anything that mattered in a way it mattered, for the combo to hit the field and be ready.

 

The Ability on Ludicolo (XY - Primal Clash 12/160) requires you flip a coin for it to work;  if they can keep doing it turn after turn, that would be "luck".  The Ability on Victreebel (XY - Furious Fists 3/111) requires you discard a [G] Energy from it to activate; that's expensive in PTCG terms!  If someone keeps using that Ability turn after turn, they can't build up another attacker, at least, not without compatible Energy acceleration.  Back to Ludicolo, it needs [GCC] to attack, has only 130 HP, and only heals 20 while doing 80.  Yeah, it heals its whole Bench... unless your deck has damage spreading effects, its probably only healing 20 from itself.  150 damage spread out over two turns isn't much.

 

I'm not saying it won't be tricky; if your opponent forces what you're trying to build on the Bench into the Active spot, you may have to shift gears, switch to something else.  If it gets OHKO'd, at least the next thing you send up won't be Confused or Poisoned.  If if doesn't get OHKO'd, you may already have the Energy on it that it needs to retreat, or maybe you can still evolve it and then attack.  Don't sweat it if you go down some Prizes.

 

I'm not saying there is no luck involved in the Pokémon TCG.  I did say - and am still saying - you can use luck to overcome the Trainer Challenge opponent's even if you can't figure out how to take them out, and even if you're still stuck using the first few decks they just give to you.  I'm saying "Yay! It is all luck based!" I am saying "Yeah, it is a slog, but you can get through it, through luck if not skill."  When you get to the "real" Pokémon TCG (and PTCGO), luck will still matter, but getting to the field first just makes success more likely, not guaranteed... and I think there's maybe one TCG I've played where that isn't an issue. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wcndave

First of all, thanks for your comprehensive and comprehensible reply!

 

I feel it only courteous to try to give as complete a response!

 

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

So I'm guessing you were already struggling before this happened; it should have taken three or four turns where you either couldn't attack or couldn't attack anything that mattered in a way it mattered, for the combo to hit the field and be ready

 

Yes, at the start you obviously both have not much to bring to the field, and have to decide whether to try to get some early shots in, or put in a sacrificial piece whilst building bench.

However, the opponent generally gets there much much quicker. because of the cards in the deck. which allow it to quickly add more, search, and then add more etc...  they seem to generally have 2-3 stage 1/2 in 3-4 turns.

 

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

Building a Stage 2 on your Bench isn't easy

 

My fully unlocked trainer deck doesn't have any stage 2.

 

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

because you just described what you thought was an "ultimate combo!" and... it isn't even close

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

The combo you described isn't actually that good, even though it seems so formidable in the Trainer Challenge, with decks you haven't fully unlocked

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

The Ability on Ludicolo (XY - Primal Clash 12/160) requires you flip a coin for it to work;  if they can keep doing it turn after turn, that would be "luck".  The Ability on Victreebel (XY - Furious Fists 3/111) requires you discard a [G] Energy from it to activate; that's expensive in PTCG terms!  If someone keeps using that Ability turn after turn, they can't build up another attacker, at least, not without compatible Energy acceleration.  Back to Ludicolo, it needs [GCC] to attack, has only 130 HP, and only heals 20 while doing 80.  Yeah, it heals its whole Bench... unless your deck has damage spreading effects, its probably only healing 20 from itself.  150 damage spread out over two turns isn't much.

 

My Basics have the following HP: 60, 60, 30, 60, 60, 120, 120, 60.

My stage 1s... 1 can do 100 damage but loses all 3 energy, another does 80 and loses 1, and finally two that do 70, with no loss of energy, however only have 80HP.

First couple of turns, the trainer has some 140 card out there, so I am generally behind, unless I can get Kangaskhan with 120 hp and 40 damage, that's the only card that can last more than one turn.  

Then 50% of the time it will be confused (so can do 40 damage), however will be dead next time, and if it does 40 damage 50% of the time, and the opponent heals 20 per turns...

Oh, and it gets swapped out after one turn, or after I put it in, so it never gets a chance to attack, all the cards with.

 

Even with the coin flips, doing a poison, swap, confuse, heal every turn, when 90% of your cards can only take one hit, needs more than just a bit of luck.

 

 

On 1/25/2020 at 1:27 AM, Otakutron said:

I'm not saying it won't be tricky; if your opponent forces what you're trying to build on the Bench into the Active spot, you may have to shift gears, switch to something else.  If it gets OHKO'd, at least the next thing you send up won't be Confused or Poisoned.  If if doesn't get OHKO'd, you may already have the Energy on it that it needs to retreat, or maybe you can still evolve it and then attack.  Don't sweat it if you go down some Prizes.

 

There's nothing to shift to 😉 

Even if the next thing I send up is ok, it' can't deliver OHOK, and then will itself either be swapped or knocked out next turn.  If I retreat, then what's the point, that's tearing down what's built to stop it being torn down.... 

 

I don't worry about the "prizes", I get that, however it took 30 odd goes to get the Luck or a decent stage one in one hand, with extra damage, and them NOT having that combo, before I won.

 

I could also just go to bingo night....... just saying.

 

Playing against people seems like it might be worse, cos everyone collects good cards, guess I'm just used to board games where playing field is even.  Seems like you have to sink a lot of cash to win.  Great for card companies, less so for parents.  Know my sister's family have spent thousands on Magic, don't want to go there....

 

Will play black/white battle with son with balanced set, but don't think I'll let him take it any further.

 

Thanks again for the comprehensive response!

 

Dave

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SandaledOtter
5 hours ago, Wcndave said:

Playing against people seems like it might be worse, cos everyone collects good cards, guess I'm just used to board games where playing field is even.  Seems like you have to sink a lot of cash to win.  Great for card companies, less so for parents.  Know my sister's family have spent thousands on Magic, don't want to go there....

 

Will play black/white battle with son with balanced set, but don't think I'll let him take it any further.

 

There is nowhere in the online game to spend any money, so as long as you don't get physical cards, you're OK. You can build a good collection without spending money.

 

1) Play the trainers for coins and get better theme decks.

2) Use better theme decks to play other people WHO ALSO WILL BE USING THEME DECKS to get cards, coins, and tickets.

3) Do the daily challenges to reach level 16.

4) At level 16, do the knockout challenges to win tradable packs.

5) Use the tickets to enter event tourneys to try to win tradable packs.

6) Use those unopened packs to get better cards by trading.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wcndave
On 1/27/2020 at 4:59 PM, SandaledOtter said:

 

There is nowhere in the online game to spend any money, so as long as you don't get physical cards, you're OK. You can build a good collection without spending money.

 

1) Play the trainers for coins and get better theme decks.

2) Use better theme decks to play other people WHO ALSO WILL BE USING THEME DECKS to get cards, coins, and tickets.

3) Do the daily challenges to reach level 16.

4) At level 16, do the knockout challenges to win tradable packs.

5) Use the tickets to enter event tourneys to try to win tradable packs.

6) Use those unopened packs to get better cards by trading.

 

Yes, sorry, I meant in the offline version, ie IRL.  My son wants to get some cards, and we were just using the app to learn how to play more than anything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Fatcatz2007

If you kid wants more cards but you are worried about the money, you should probably get him them for holidays,birthdays, and good test grades. ALSO, something I think noobs need to learn in this huge powe rcreep era (S&M/SW&SH) is that dont stuff all of your gxs of several types is one deck. Focus on using good trainers and abilities. My best deck which is the deck i usally use justt has 3 eevee gx, 3 vaporeon gx and 1 glaceon gx, not a lot of ultra rares.

 

Sorry for all the spelling mistakes, i was in a hurry.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Moyu6464
On 11/26/2018 at 8:49 AM, Scarlet_Thunder said:

This is my first day on this game and I can't defeat the first opponent in the trainer challenge because the decks it limits me to are HORRIBLE and Zach has pokemon that can defeat mine in two attacks.

 

I don't understand. There is no difficulty option either. I've been trying to figure this out for hours and I am very irritated. I'd simply go on to player vs. player battles however it's my first day thus, everyone can beat me in a matter of moments. There's no way I can advance in this game. 

i have the relentless flame theme deck (sun and moon team up) and that works GREAT. its at walmart for 21.95 i think

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
SandaledOtter
3 hours ago, Moyu6464 said:

i have the relentless flame theme deck (sun and moon team up) and that works GREAT. its at walmart for 21.95 i think

It's in the shop for 500 tokens, as well.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Otakutron
On 2/5/2020 at 6:46 PM, Moyu6464 said:

i have the relentless flame theme deck (sun and moon team up) and that works GREAT. its at walmart for 21.95 i think

 

Did you mean 12.95 USD, or is it a different currency?  MSRP for Theme Decks is 12.99 USD.  Wal-Mart usually shaves at least a few cents off of that.  Unless Wal-Marts in your area are starting to act more like or lease out shelf-space to actual card shops.  Meaning, something old and collectible gets marked up instead of marked down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
R8Spike
On 2/3/2020 at 10:56 PM, Fatcatz2007 said:

If you kid wants more cards but you are worried about the money, you should probably get him them for holidays,birthdays, and good test grades. ALSO, something I think noobs need to learn in this huge powe rcreep era (S&M/SW&SH) is that dont stuff all of your gxs of several types is one deck. Focus on using good trainers and abilities. My best deck which is the deck i usally use justt has 3 eevee gx, 3 vaporeon gx and 1 glaceon gx, not a lot of ultra rares.

 

Sorry for all the spelling mistakes, i was in a hurry.

 It's ok to have other types, but for support. (i.e  jrachi in malamar decks, lele in every pre-rotation deck, garboror in Zorark garbodor decks) you should focus on 1 energy types, 2 if dragon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...