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Dealing With Garchomp/Lucario/Cynthia


Americalover55

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Americalover55

I know Glaceon GX can block GX and EX abilities. Is there another card like it that blocks the rest of the abilities that can be used for the upcoming rotation and this one?

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Garchomp should have retreat cost. It's too easy and abusive to play this deck. Not balanced.

I agree with Cesittos, Furthermore, there seems to be a fierce defense in the forums for this deck. Presumably from people who use it. Look bottom line, this deck is a game breaker. And to the people

I ask with complete honesty: Do you know what the word 'objective' means?

BenXBlack93

There's still no card that block abilities for the next rotation (besides alolan muk that blocks abilities only for basic pokemon)  if i'm not mistaken we will have to wait and see if they print a new card for the upcoming sets that blocks all abilities like garbodor. 

 

But to deal with garchomp/lucario add two copies of enhanced hammer and/or run a deck with garbodor or you can also play a disruption deck like quad sylveon gx or wishiwashi gx stall deck.

Edited by EpicShonenGuy
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HoHo_Uchiha

^Yeah I've been the prey and ******** with those cards for sure and lately when I faced a Deck like that, I had my Buzzwole by my side to put damage here and there to the point where when my opponent final reaches to Garchomp they are a weak version of themselves.

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RealFolkBlues0

I agree with Cesittos, Furthermore, there seems to be a fierce defense in the forums for this deck. Presumably from people who use it. Look bottom line, this deck is a game breaker. And to the people using it, you are unoriginal, untalented, and feeling gratification from someone else's work building the deck. Which again, should be made illegal. It's like all the problems with the game right now together in one deck. Just some objective observations...

 

Now for my personal opinion. When I see you have this deck and you start taking 5 minutes per turn milling through your deck, don't feel accomplished or superior when I concede. I'm only doing it because you are sapping all of the fun from the game and I don't have time to sit around all day while you play with yourself.

Edited by RealFolkBlues0
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SuperStone

Just some objective observations...

I ask with complete honesty: Do you know what the word 'objective' means?

Edited by SuperStone
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Wait until the fighting type Garchomp line comes out... :D That'll be fun.

A simple Garchomp-Lucario deck is not difficult to deal with, because even with the auto-evolution and Computer Search ability they still have the inconsistency of a stage1 combined with a stage2 deck, so basically any decent deck should be able to deal with that without any problems. (Unless the Garchomps get very lucky.)

However, if they have stuff that boost consistency like Vulpix or Lele (which is actually worse since it's an easy 2 prize on their side) then a deck that needs to use 1-2 Lele to set up and/or has a main attacker that gives up 2 prizes can easily lose the prize trade, since it's suprisingly easy to hit 200-230 with Garchomp. (Obvious exceptions are Solgaleo and Metagross) Only thing you can do is try to outplay the deck and kill off everything while they are still in their basic form. (Consistent fairy decks with a competent attacker are probably the best in this case since they can pick off the Garchomps at every stage easily.) It can be somewhat annoying but I guess TPCi wanted a ready-made deck (with fanservice to boot) for beginners so that game could become even more accessible and they could make even more $$$.

Also, teching in Enhanced Hammers just because of this deck for decks that otherwise do not need it (and thus get 2 dead cards for other match-ups) is a terrible advice.

I think the deck is about as "meta" as Typhlosion is - which means that you are most likely to run into it online than IRL.

Edited by Toklopo
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BenXBlack93

Wait until the fighting type Garchomp line comes out... :D That'll be fun.

 

A simple Garchomp-Lucario deck is not difficult to deal with, because even with the auto-evolution and Computer Search ability they still have the inconsistency of a stage1 combined with a stage2 deck, so basically any decent deck should be able to deal with that without any problems. (Unless the Garchomps get very lucky.)

 

However, if they have stuff that boost consistency like Vulpix or Lele (which is actually worse since it's an easy 2 prize on their side) then a deck that needs to use 1-2 Lele to set up and/or has a main attacker that gives up 2 prizes can easily lose the prize trade, since it's suprisingly easy to hit 200-230 with Garchomp. (Obvious exceptions are Solgaleo and Metagross) Only thing you can do is try to outplay the deck and kill off everything while they are still in their basic form. (Consistent fairy decks with a competent attacker are probably the best in this case since they can pick off the Garchomps at every stage easily.) It can be somewhat annoying but I guess TPCi wanted a ready-made deck (with fanservice to boot) for beginners so that game could become even more accessible and they could make even more $$$.

 

Also, teching in Enhanced Hammers just because of this deck for decks that otherwise do not need it (and thus get 2 dead cards for other match-ups) is a terrible advice.

 

I think the deck is about as "meta" as Typhlosion is - which means that you are most likely to run into it online than IRL.

Saying that "teching 2 enhanced hammers is a terrible advice" is an over the top statement in fact it's the other way around it is a great advice and i'll tell you why. Zoroark and Buzzwole are everywhere in the current meta and the most winning tournaments decks rely a lot on special energy so discarding that strong energy, DCE or any other special energy is huge it's not just for this specific deck the current meta is very reliant on special energy so adding two enhanced hammers can become a game changer and even give you the victory.

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Unless you're playing full distruption/stall it's just not worth it imo and is too opportunistic/situational if you don't have anything in your deck that can grab it exactly when you need it -  sure it can give you the win if everything aligns but Zoroark plays Puzzles, (best way to counter Zoroark is just to hit it with anything fighting that OHKOs Zorua/Zoroark) even the better Garchomp/Lucario lists play Puzzles and Buzzwole doesn't rely on special energy alone. But each to their own I guess.
 

Once the puzzles rotate (and provided there will be no reliable alternative to get special energy back from the discard) and once Beast Energy also becomes a thing I could see every deck running 1-2 copies of E. Hammer but until then I'd rather just use those two slots to help with the consistency of a deck because Standard is still really lacking in that department.

Edited by Toklopo
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BowserLuigi

Well, I just went ahead and tried out Mach Strike GX and honestly... it's nowhere near as OP as some people claim it is. Stage 2 consistency issues aside, the inability to use Guzma is HUGE *** it can but then it can't OHKO anything worth a ***). Maybe a Brigette build would help get out those basics easier but Lele taking up bench space is annoying.

 

Yeah it's mighty for a budget deck but not OP at all.

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Gutterpuppy11

It’s no big deal in expanded ( long live expanded ) I’ve yet to see it there.

 

In standard ( die standard) I don’t really know however, in the theme tournaments I play in Mach strike and imperial command are dominant and if you use anything else your done so I use Mach strike.

 

I don’t see why it should be a problem in standard though ultra Necrozma is coming and Mach strike, gardevoir, and the entire meta game is going to get hit by an ultra truck so, if you pull ultra Necrozma your already world championship.

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Omegaki113r

I know Glaceon GX can block GX and EX abilities. Is there another card like it that blocks the rest of the abilities that can be used for the upcoming rotation and this one?

Actually i am running on a mach strike deck. True it feels like cheating. it really is. I want to stop using it and build my own deck. Reason is i can't is that born and living in a 3rd world country means no shops to buy boosters and deck (physical). Therefore i am forced to win in game Versus matches to collect some cards. So playing the Mach strike is the best (cheat) way to go. I don't like it too. Win rate is high. though winning doesn't satisfying. Once i was beaten with Glaceon Gx. So yeah... I played TCGO for 2 months now. Only that deck beat me. other times i got unlucky and didn't found the cards i want. 

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A simple Garchomp-Lucario deck is not difficult to deal with, because even with the auto-evolution and Computer Search ability they still have the inconsistency of a stage1 combined with a stage2 deck, so basically any decent deck should be able to deal with that without any problems. (Unless the Garchomps get very lucky.)

 

 

 

 

I like how you glance over that this deck allows a first turn garchomp and that all you need is 1 energy and a 1st stage to get a turn 2 garchomp. If i cant take them out in the first 2 turns ,which i never can, I have about a 99% chance of loosing against this deck. It has gotten to the point to that when I see that they have the garchomp coin, I know i have lost. I would also like to point out before I get told this, that just because you can counter a deck with rare cards does not mean that the deck is easy to counter. I do not want to hear "you can counter it easy with this very specific card that you have like a 0.001 chance of getting"

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Player_Jay

I like how you glance over that this deck allows a first turn garchomp and that all you need is 1 energy and a 1st stage to get a turn 2 garchomp. If i cant take them out in the first 2 turns ,which i never can, I have about a 99% chance of loosing against this deck. It has gotten to the point to that when I see that they have the garchomp coin, I know i have lost. I would also like to point out before I get told this, that just because you can counter a deck with rare cards does not mean that the deck is easy to counter. I do not want to hear "you can counter it easy with this very specific card that you have like a 0.001 chance of getting"

I can raise you one better!

 

I like how you glance over that this forum is from March.

You are in a direct violation of the forum rules.

 

Your commenting to a person after 5 months of hind sight.

Players in March didn’t play the deck the same ways as in August.

The person in March didn’t “Glance Over”

The strategy didn’t exist in March.

 

Please tell me how did you feel talking smack to that person from March?

Did it make you feel good?

 

Maybe, We can jump on time machine and travel back in time to see some Mayans.

Than we will talk smack to the Mayans for not having WiFi!

Mayans as an advanced civilization? Ha Ha

What a Joke!

 

They glanced over WiFi!

They can’t be that advanced.

Edited by Player_Jay
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I can raise you one better!

 

I like how you glance over that this forum is from March.

 

You are in a direct violation of the forum rules.

 

Your commenting to a person after 5 months of hind sight.

 

Players in March didn’t play the deck the same ways as in August.

 

The person in March didn’t “Glance Over”

 

The strategy didn’t exist in March.

 

Please tell me how did you feel talking smack to that person from March?

 

Did it make you feel good?

 

Maybe, We can jump on time machine and travel back in time to see some Mayans.

 

Than we will talk smack to the Mayans for not having WiFi!

 

Mayans as an advanced civilization? Ha Ha

 

What a Joke!

 

They glanced over WiFi!

 

They can’t be that *********

** far as i have seen the strat of garchomp and lucario is almost the same. Could never beat it than or now. I and just very tired of the feeling of seeing those cards and knowing I pretty much just auto lost. I can deal pretty well or at least decent against most decksm what i am trying to say is that you should atleast feel that you have a chance to beat a deck.
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BowserLuigi

** far as i have seen the strat of garchomp and lucario is almost the same. Could never beat it than or now. I and just very tired of the feeling of seeing those cards and knowing I pretty much just auto lost. I can deal pretty well or at least decent against most decksm what i am trying to say is that you should atleast feel that you have a chance to beat a deck.

Just to clarify are you actually talking about theme or standard/expanded? I'm guessing standard/expanded and if I'm right then I'll just tell you that Modified Mach Strike is not top-tier right now (and never was). It is also impossible to set up a Garchomp on turn 1 no matter what you do (as time of writing)

 

If you're talking about theme then I have no further comment

Edited by BowserLuigi
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Just to clarify are you actually talking about theme or standard/expanded? I'm guessing standard/expanded and if I'm right then I'll just tell you that Modified Mach Strike is not top-tier right now (and never was). It is also impossible to set up a Garchomp on turn 1 no matter what you do (as time of writing)

If you're talking about theme then I have no further comment

for the one turn garchomp, i am referring to when he goes first than next turn evolves and accends. Not really turn 1 but the firt turn he can attack. I can see how it is bot top tier because most people here most likely have poured hundreds of dollars and/or into the game i just casual play it. Just trying to say that it ruins the game for noobies when they have to face people with the newest most powerful cards while we have only the basics. So for now i guess i will continue to just auto forfeit when ever i see someone use the deck. No point in wasting my time on a battle i know i will lose.
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Player_Jay

for the one turn garchomp, i am referring to when he goes first than next turn evolves and accends. Not really turn 1 but the firt turn he can attack. I can see how it is bot top tier because most people here most likely have poured hundreds of dollars and/or into the game i just casual play it. Just trying to say that it ruins the game for noobies when they have to face people with the newest most powerful cards while we have only the basics. So for now i guess i will continue to just auto forfeit when ever i see someone use the deck. No point in wasting my time on a battle i know i will lose.

The reason you lose is because you are scared of the deck.

Your fear makes the deck stronger than it really is.

 

Weather you spend no dollars or millions of dollars, you can’t win!

You can’t win because you have let your fear get the better of you.

 

You know everything there is to know about that deck.

There is nothing stopping you from completely destroying it.

Your fear & excuses are what hold you back.

 

Every deck in Pokémon has a weakness.

Every deck in Pokémon can be countered.

You just have to see Weakness & Attack!

 

Garchomp is a Stage 2 Pokémon.

Stage 2 Decks are vulnerable to Basic non-evolution decks.

Why? Because Basic decks are faster.

 

It takes a lot of cards to get Garchomp on the field.

Think about your example!

How did the player get Garchomp on his field turn 2?

-He had to use support card named “Wally” to evolve it 1 time.

-He had to attack with ascension to get Garchomp.

 

Well think about the weakness of such moves!

If your using Wally, You are not using a draw supporter to get more cards in your hand.

This means the person going next might get the advantage because he can use draw card to speed by faster!

This demonstrates how “Garchomp” can be slow because it is Stage 2.

This demonstrates how you can take advantage of his slow stage 2 Pokémon by pressuring them with a speedy Basic/Stage 1 Pokémon.

 

The result is you can beat them before they fully set up.

This is 1 reason Garchomp isn’t the best deck.

 

———————

 

Other weakness the deck has is Garchomp is a Dragon Pokémon.

Dragon Pokémon have a weakness vs. Fairy Pokémon.

A Fairy Pokémon does 2x the Damage vs. Garchomp.

 

If you play a fairy deck, you can destroy Dragon Garchomp decks.

You will crush them very well.

 

—————

 

Other weakness the deck relies on Pokémon abilities.

They use Lucario ability to search for stuff in the deck.

 

You can play a deck that shuts down all Abilities!

This would case there Lucario’s to be worthless.

It will completely destroy there strategy.

 

A Pokémon named Garbordor can lock down the opponent Abilities!

 

———————-

 

Another weakness the deck has is vs. Energy Discard decks.

Garchomp Attack is [F][C][C].

It is considered a 2-3 energy Attachment deck.

 

They have to put 1 Fighting energy + 1 Double Colorless energy or 3 Fighting energies in order to attack.

This makes the deck vulnerable to Energy Discard decks.

Decks that run bunches of hammers trying to mill out the Garchomp deck.

 

Garchomp is a very straight forward Pokémon.

Garchomp wins the fight by killing the opponent Pokémon with a 200+ Attack!

 

If Garchomp has no energy, Garchomp can’t attack.

If Garchomp doesn’t Attack, Garchomp can’t win!

Weakness!

 

———————

 

Another Weakness the deck has is it is vulnerable to Status Condition decks.

A moment ago, I said Garchomp is a straight forward Pokémon!

Garchomp wins by killing the opponent Pokémon!

 

However, what happens if attacking, The opponent Pokémon is to risky?

How can Attacking be risky?

The answer Status Condition’s!

 

Let’s say Garchomp is confused!

Garchomp can try to attack, but if he does he might attack himself!

The Status Condition “Confusion” can put Garchomp in tough spot.

 

Let’s give another example:

Let’s say Garchomp is poisoned!

Garchomp can try to attack you, but if he does the Poison might kill him!

 

The result is the opponent will than be forced to retreat Garchomp!

They retreat Garchomp to get rid of the Status Condition, BUT THERE LIES THE PROBLEM!

 

If they are retreating Garchomp, They are not attacking with Garchomp!

And remember what I said.

The only way Garchomp wins is by attacking.

They can’t attack from the bench!

 

This is why Status Condition decks are a weakness!

 

————————

 

I hope the above example can show you why Garchomp isn’t that great.

It can be difficult to see the ways to beat Garchomp.

It doesn’t take hundreds of dollars to beat Garchomp.

All it takes is a person observing the weakness & trying to counter!

 

Every card in the game has a draw back/weakness.

Cards with no draw backs are often ban by the Pokémon game.

The Pokémon game tries to maintain a balance!

 

You just have to find the weakness.

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BowserLuigi

for the one turn garchomp, i am referring to when he goes first than next turn evolves and accends. Not really turn 1 but the firt turn he can attack. I can see how it is bot top tier because most people here most likely have poured hundreds of dollars and/or into the game i just casual play it. Just trying to say that it ruins the game for noobies when they have to face people with the newest most powerful cards while we have only the basics. So for now i guess i will continue to just auto forfeit when ever i see someone use the deck. No point in wasting my time on a battle i know i will lose.

But Garchomp/Lucario is a budget deck that almost everyone can build. It's not Buzzvole or Zoroark GX or Rayquaza. Why are you still complaining? And no most of us here do not spend hundreds on the game (I did not spend a single cent unless you count my internet subscription).

 

As Player_Jay mentioned using Ascencion is horribly inefficient and everyone that plays that deck hopes that they never ever have to use the move. What they hope to do is use Rare Candy to instantly skip to Garchomp.

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I guess i should point this out. I have little to no fairy types, i have no pokemon that stop abilities, and i do nit believe i have any basic pokemon that coukd take out a garchomp in 1 or 2 turns becuase any basics i have that can do near that much damage need 2 to 3 turns at least to get enough energy to attack. Plus why use wally when yohvcan use the evolsoda thing. Would also add that it is more of a hate than a fear. It is more of a hate because i have to face someone using a super cheap strat to auto win against people like me who have not yet had the chance to put in enough time to get the good counter cards.

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Princess_Aurora

I guess i should point this out. I have little to no fairy types, i have no pokemon that stop abilities, and i do nit believe i have any basic pokemon that coukd take out a garchomp in 1 or 2 turns becuase any basics i have that can do near that much damage need 2 to 3 turns at least to get enough energy to attack. Plus why use wally when yohvcan use the evolsoda thing. Would also add that it is more of a hate than a fear. It is more of a hate because i have to face someone using a super cheap strat to auto win against people like me who have not yet had the chance to put in enough time to get the good counter cards.

Sorry if I sound harsh, but Garchomp/Lucario is an “auto win” deck by your standards? You’ll have a hard time when you see GX everywhere. Nevermind the Tag Team GX cards.

 

Worse case scenarios, you can always play a Garchomp/Lucario deck yourself, it’s relatively cheap to cobble up using 1000 Tokens and a few UC Chests.

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MewSevenSeven

I guess i should point this out. I have little to no fairy types, i have no pokemon that stop abilities, and i do nit believe i have any basic pokemon that coukd take out a garchomp in 1 or 2 turns becuase any basics i have that can do near that much damage need 2 to 3 turns at least to get enough energy to attack. Plus why use wally when yohvcan use the evolsoda thing. Would also add that it is more of a hate than a fear. It is more of a hate because i have to face someone using a super cheap strat to auto win against people like me who have not yet had the chance to put in enough time to get the good counter cards.

There are ways to get decent decks with $0:

 

Buy a versus deck from shop (pick 1 out of the 6 newest ones) then play Versus matches using that theme deck. This will give you a sense of the game. Hopefully you get good & lucky enough to get 2x Gardevoir GX cards + coins + tokens + Celestial Storm packs in the next 3 weeks.

Use the coins to buy whatever decks you need to get some staple trainer cards (Garchomp theme deck has 2 Cynthias for example)

When you have 4 tickets, use them to play in Event / Theme deck tournament. Trade the chest or booster pack(s) you get from the tourney for cards you still need.

 

Tada a Gardevoir GX deck

 

 

Or buy a Garchomp theme deck and use it to play CPU (Trainer Challenge), get 500 coins, and buy another Garchomp deck.

Tada a cheap Garchomp deck.

Again, if you do the Versus & tourney route above (theme format, using your Mach Strike deck) you can trade for cards to improve your Garchomp deck.

 

 

 

I am sorry, but you cannot just expect to win against good/great decks without any decent deck of your own.

Edited by MewSevenSeven
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