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Hidden Moon weakness


Xi_of_SCS
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Everybody's playing Hidden Moon in Theme matches and there are very few options for Darkness hitters to bring down Lunala?

 

The weakness of the Hidden Moon lies in what it does not have. Those four bonus trainers over the usual dozen and all those nice pokes lack three things. The only way a Hidden Moon deck can ever change the opponent's energy cards or active poke is by knocking out pokes. Yes, it's really good at knocking out your active poke, but it can't do anything at all to your bench and can't remove energy from your active poke or even change one card in your hand.

 

Therefore you can feed the useless baby pokes every other theme deck is cursed with to Hidden Moon's attacks while building up your super attackers on your own bench and in your own time. You can plan your moves five steps ahead and there is nothing the Hidden Moon player can do to disrupt your plans.

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Yeah, but then when you put your big bad attacker upfront, that either gives them a turn to use Wings Of the Moone, making your KO pointless, or if you get a 1HKO, they'll just use the AMAZING Mimikyu to 1HKO you back.

And as for no Bench snipers, enter Oricario, who can shut down games.

While it is true Hidden Moon has no hand disruption, what deck does, aside from Hidden Depths, and what deck does have major Energy discard effects or forced switching effects (Escape Rope does not count, enter Altar of the Moone)?

While it does have little to disrupt you, if you try and play the slow way, I'll just set up more efficiently than you can with Mimikyu's Filch (again, that card is SO good in Theme) and build up either a Bewear to put on the pressure (I've won games with Stuffle's second attack), or I'll set a Lunala, wait for you to commit your attacker, and 1HKO it.

That's what Theme format strategy revolves around. "How long can I wait before using my main attacker, and how fast can I make my opponent use his?" It's a waiting game where the first one to throw out their big gun regrets it most. And what makes Hidden Moon so OP, is that it can call it's opponent's bluff, and hope to outgun his attackers.

And yes, the only valid Dark attacker in Theme is Zoroark, and all you have to do to beat him is just to control your Bench.

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Control Mimikyu with situational attacks that don't apply in reverse. Like say bonus damage for attacking basics.

 

Night Striker vs Hidden Moon

  • You've got Drag Off to choose your victim.
  • Beckon, Reserved Ticket and Tuning can't be undone by a forced reshuffle.
  • Low or no retreat cost (for most of the pokes) deals with confuse ray
  • Gengar combines bench attack with a cheap KO
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By the time Drag Off is ready, I've already got multiple attackers in play and Altar of the Moone and Switch.

Beckon and Tuning give up easy prizes, and in the latter case, waste an important attacker. Though Tuning does work quite well. And Reserved Ticket is a once-per-game gamble, rather than an actual strategy.

You class Gothorita as a threat?! Last thing on my mind when using HM is inflicting Confusion, unless I'm desperate.

Even Bewear/Stuffle can do enough damage to 2HKO Gengar with Kukui/Salazzle before he can do any real damage, given there's no other Bench snipers in the deck other than Drag Off, which doesn't really count. And Creep Show is well met by... you guessed it, Mimikyu. There's a situational attack I'd like to see you stop. And no, the one PCL isn't going to do it.

And that's before Lunala gets rocking. Let's not kid ourselves here, the only way you are going to beat HM with NS is if your opponent gets unlucky (which can very easily happen in Theme, eg: prized Mimi) or obligingly fills his Bench for Zoroark (who is amazing).

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Control Mimikyu with situational attacks that don't apply in reverse. Like say bonus damage for attacking basics.

 

Night Striker vs Hidden Moon

 

  • You've got Drag Off to choose your victim.
  • Beckon, Reserved Ticket and Tuning can't be undone by a forced reshuffle.
  • Low or no retreat cost (for most of the pokes) deals with confuse ray
  • Gengar combines bench attack with a cheap KO

Except that if Mimikyu decides that it wants to attack, it doesn't sit in the active and wait for you to hit him. He stays on the bench, jumps in to smack you really hard if you try to do the same, then runs away to safety (assuming that he's still alive).

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Pull Mimikyu active and zap it, remove energy from it on the bench or attack it on the bench.

 

I.e. use abilities that Hidden Moon lacks.

Drag off doesn't even OHKO mimikyu. And you're trying to stop a situational attacker instead of that bear or giant moon bat in front of you.

 

Is Mimikyu such a threat that you would rather spend turns trying to snipe it off with 2 shots while you let their main attacker wail on you all this time? Ignoring the fact that even if you do drag Mimikyu out he can just retreat with altar of the moone (or just pay the retreat) back to their main attacker.

Edited by BowserLuigi
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How do you intend to remove the Energy?

Last I checked (2 minutes ago), the only reliable way to discard Energy in Theme is to play XY Blue with 1 TFG. And that matchup would be a slaughter.

You could play Wave Slasher with Slowking, but that deck has as much damage output as Roaring Heat minus Incineroar. Another slaughter.

Of course, there are cards like RS Fearow that discard Energy with attacks, but NS lacks any of those cards. And it's not going to stop a Lunala. Should you stop Mimikyu using Copycat, I'll either retreat/switch like BowserLuigi said, or I'll just use Filch to setup my next turn, and Rescue Stretcher Mimi back.

Benchsniping/forced switch effects really are missing in Theme anyway, which is why it's not such a big deal for HM not to have them. Oh wait, it does have Oricario. The Benchsniper of all Benchsnipers. Trust me, I play a Vesp deck. That thing is overpowered as ****.

Like I said, NS's one redeeming feature is Zoroark, who is a decent attacker, but is ultimately rendered powerless by a smart player.

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Best matchup I've seen is Rock Steady

 

Use Brooklet Hill to tempt out Altar of the Moone then put one psi energy on each of your rock-types (that are vulnerable to grass, which Hidden Moon doesn't have) as you power them up in order to retreat from confusion, poisoned and burned at low cost.

 

HM has nothing that beats Stance, but you'll only play that once or maybe twice. Your 170 point attack is a one-shot kill, but you can't apply it every turn and even with Moone the retreat cost is too high. You'll most likely use the rope after one-shoting Lunala with Rock Wrecker.

 

Save up all the unmatched pokes in your hand (which HM can't disrupt) for the big finishing move of Hand Kinesis.

 

Your response to the threat of Copycat is to use Bouffant Head to negate all damage, followed by one of your big attacks after a Moone escape.

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