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Impossible for new players to get into this game * Cards)


deathzolth
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I have been playing this game extensively for a couple of days now, could buy 4 theme decks with my gold, however the game pretty much stops for me here.



Any sort of PvP mode which isn't restricted to theme only is literally unplayable for me.



The reason is that every.single.deck I face is full of EX cards. Cards so overpowered that a single one of them can beat my whole deck. And those decks are full of them.



I asked one of them how he got all of these overpowered cards and he told me they were tournament prizes.



I tried 3-4 tournaments already and guess what? They are equally unplayable and equally full of EX cards. Even with my best first hand I couldn't beat a single one of them. Maybe with my best hand and strategy I could kill one EX card, too bad they have 10+ others in their deck.



How is a new player supposed to get into this game?

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theme deck tournaments.

 

also what you describe is pretty much not what happens.  playing ranked games you are matched against people of similar rank.  I've played decks with only starter cards in them before and you will be matched with similar folks.  so what you describe does not occur.  either they are terrible EX cards or bad players when you face someone with clearly a deck that outclasses you.

 

The shortest path to increasing your collection or competitive decks (other than buying very reasonably priced codes) is to play ranked to get tickets and tokens, and play theme deck tournaments for tradeable packs.

 

you do not need a good deck to play ranked games at all.  all decks will approach 50% win rate after a while.

if you do not have great cards yet, avoid remaking decks as you may reset your rank if you make a new deck (not positive on this).

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3 months.

 

It's the time you need to set up a tier 1 deck.

 

It's not about: I like that Pokémon, let's make a deck with. It's not about, I have this cards, I'm going to build a deck.

 

It's all about there is a tier 1 deck and I like (or I can afford) so I'm going to build it. Disappointing yes, but it's the way it is.

 

Look for cards you need in the Theme (some of them bring some good cards) and trade for the rest when you know how it works and the values of the cards, not before because you'll get scammed.

 

And 3 months it's the time you need to have a very good tier 1 deck if you focus on build that.

 

I started with Donphan but there are some others, Night March, the Bats... NO EX decks or decks with cheap EXs.

 

Of course having VirGen or Seismitoad EX+Keldeo EX make it easy, but are expensive decks.

 

This is not a game, it's actually a competition where you make friends.

 

And of course a business. If you spend money will be faster and easier, but it's not necessary!

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also what you describe is pretty much not what happens.  playing ranked games you are matched against people of similar rank.  I've played decks with only starter cards in them before and you will be matched with similar folks.  so what you describe does not occur.  either they are terrible EX cards or bad players when you face someone with clearly a deck that outclasses you.

 

 

I haven't tried ranked yet but in regular versus (standard mode) games and tournaments I am queued against full ex deck pretty much every single game.

 

I am gonna try them.

 

EDIT: Which mode are you taking about, I can't find a specific ranked mode.

All I see is versus games... 

 

 

The shortest path to increasing your collection or competitive decks (other than buying very reasonably priced codes) is to play ranked to get tickets and tokens, and play theme deck tournaments for tradeable packs.

 

As fas as I can see, Theme deck tournaments only give tickets as prices. I have enough tickets already from versus games but they are pretty useless to me as I can't win ticket tournaments.

 

Thanks for the advices from both of you either way.

Edited by deathzolth
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also what you describe is pretty much not what happens.  playing ranked games you are matched against people of similar rank.  I've played decks with only starter cards in them before and you will be matched with similar folks.  so what you describe does not occur.  either they are terrible EX cards or bad players when you face someone with clearly a deck that outclasses you.

 

I gave it another chance by trying 3 standard and unlimited versus games.

 

Every single one of them was against a deck full of EX cards, shiny cards and custom sleeves I have never seen, clearly old players.

 

Needless to stay I was stomped within 3-4 turns.

 

For something which is never supposed to happen it seems quite common... :s

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After 3 days it is rather unlikely that you have the necessary cards / skills / deck building know how to compete with the top decks of the current meta, but that the fun and learning experience of any tcg. Keep in mind that everyone once started at zero, so we all know that the start can be kinda rough.

 

Stick to the tips that have already been provided, play theme deck tournaments ( they rotate every week, so next week they should have tournament tickets as an entry fee and give boosters as prizes), try to learn about the game ( check out threads like “ how to counter EX”, “ dive in program for new players”or “the best decks in tcg”, where you'll find plenty of help towards deck building and so forth.

 

As always keep in mind that this is about fun and if you feel that the core concept of a tcg, or the way it is represented in the Pokemon tcg online client doesn't appeal to you, then thats not bad either, as everyone has his own taste :D.

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I gave it another chance by trying 3 standard and unlimited versus games.

 

Every single one of them was against a deck full of EX cards, shiny cards and custom sleeves I have never seen, clearly old players.

 

Needless to stay I was stomped within 3-4 turns.

 

For something which is never supposed to happen it seems quite common... :s

 

It happens to everyone everyday. Maybe he is one of those with plenty FULL ART Seismi and Keldeo and Kyogre EX + SR gold trainers + Full Art N and Juniper and Korrina Supporters everywhere whom I'm facing everyday with 3 cows and a band of bats after 3 months playing. Maybe he doesn't realize because is one of them or because have some tier 1 decks or because is used to or because don't remember when started. Doesn't mind. But of course it happens!

 

I was like 1 full month playing theme and doing the Trainers Challenge vs. the AI. The best Theme decks are Dark Hammer and Mental Might. The Basic ones not bad at all but if you face with weakness you loose in 3 turns. With the Theme at least there are 2 to 3 different types.

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yes versus is ranked.

keep using same deck in same format.  it takes a few games to get your ranking correct.  it is ELO based.  every time you lose you lose ELO rating and get matched with worse players.

 

it seems to me you are jumping around too much looking for easy quick results.  hence the system is not getting the chance to get your rank correctly.

 

tournaments are on a weekly roration.  next week theme decks will award packs and standard will award tickets. and it will flip every week.  and every 4 weeks or so theme deck tournaments will be the 5 ticket tournament on a weekend where you can win 5 packs if you win, and 1 pack if you only win once.

 

judging from your level of patience though, i think you should spend a few bucks and get some codes.  they can be as cheap as $0.20 a pack and then you can use the trading companies here to buy the cards you need.

 

playing entirely for free and building a competitive deck will take time.

 

 

I gave it another chance by trying 3 standard and unlimited versus games.

 

Every single one of them was against a deck full of EX cards, shiny cards and custom sleeves I have never seen, clearly old players.

 

Needless to stay I was stomped within 3-4 turns.

 

For something which is never supposed to happen it seems quite common... :s

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They removed the "ranked" vs matches a little bit ago and replaced it with "random". I have noticed a wide variety of deck strengths I am playing against. Can anyone explain the ELO system that was mentioned before? I would love to see a player rating, even if it was only visible to myself. When they used "ranked" matching even an awesome new deck would come into a cold streak as it was pitted against better decks, so it was hard to really tell which of my decks is better than another.

 

As far as the advice so far, I would agree: It takes time. I started off doing the trainer challenge to unlock cards from the basic decks, and win trade locked packs. Then went to theme ranked matches and used tokens to buy more theme decks. After not to long I could build some pretty successful mixed energy decks with mew EX and several others I randomly got for free. Of course then I was hooked and bought a bunch of codes online.

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I had the same problem starting out.  It was either Theme decks or get beat.

 

What has changed for me?

 

1. I found web sites where I could buy codes for the game, pennies on the dollar compared to what you would pay at the department store.  I can't post web links here, so use google, or send just about any experienced person a pm.  I used every promo that I got the kids for Christmas and a few I got online very cheaply. 

 

example: I bought the kids the xerneas vs yveltal deck, then later added the promo codes I got cheaply for the ex's of these.  the xerneas deck basically has the bones of a competitive fairy deck.  and the yveltal deck isn't horrible, it's better than the theme decks and that's why you can't use it there.

 

2. reading web sites, blogs, vlogs, and googling deck lists.  basically researching the game and building what I desired based on that.

 

3. study the trade in game trade forum and master it.

I don't just open my booster packs anymore.  I either buy them cheaply online (the codes are really cheap) or I collect the ones the games give me and trade for exactly what I want.

 

I've built just about every deck that I've wanted so far and i started playing this as a way to research for Christmas shopping for the kids pokemon obsession.  yes, yes, I am the coolest dad ever.

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oh nice catch.  i hadn't noticed that but that is a really good change.  random is a lot less intimidating than the old 'ranked' name.

 

elo rating was developed in chess to have a number representing how good a player is and now is adopted by most games to do the same.  basically everyone starts at a certain number .. say 1500.  when you win against a player you gain points, when you lose you lose points.  the higher your opponent is the more you win and less you lose.  so statistically it works to a pretty good model of how good you are.

 

it was mentioned in the feedback forum sometime back that there is an elo type system in the background for the random matches.  but it is unknown as of yet if the rating is tied to a deck or to your player as a whole.

 

They removed the "ranked" vs matches a little bit ago and replaced it with "random". I have noticed a wide variety of deck strengths I am playing against. Can anyone explain the ELO system that was mentioned before? I would love to see a player rating, even if it was only visible to myself. When they used "ranked" matching even an awesome new deck would come into a cold streak as it was pitted against better decks, so it was hard to really tell which of my decks is better than another.

 

As far as the advice so far, I would agree: It takes time. I started off doing the trainer challenge to unlock cards from the basic decks, and win trade locked packs. Then went to theme ranked matches and used tokens to buy more theme decks. After not to long I could build some pretty successful mixed energy decks with mew EX and several others I randomly got for free. Of course then I was hooked and bought a bunch of codes online.

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I think you can build your rank up so high in theme deck mode that when you switch to standard you end up going against giants. 

 

I remember a few games I had : dark hammer and my opponent had: yvelta-ex/garbodor or I had : mental might and my opponent played: night march

 

lol, bam!

 

the only way to correct this, unfortunately, is to lose games.

Edited by danielpeebles
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my first standard deck that I had any success with revolved around these 4 cards:

 

malamar-ex (phantom forces)

tailow/swellow (with drive away ability)

trick coin (victini is better)

 

malamar-ex can do insane amounts of damage.

 

also when I got the theme deck with vanilluxe in it, that followed the same principal.  flip coins to do insane amounts of damage.

Edited by danielpeebles
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I recommend the dive in program that Iron Bat is running. Rather than just venting about the game on the forums, you can have a mentor help you out ad you can find your way around your dislike of ex pokemans. 

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I think you can build your rank up so high in theme deck mode that when you switch to standard you end up going against giants. 

 

 

That's probably what happened to me because I won the majority of my themed versus games, and now I can't have a single decent non themed match.

 

I'll try to loose a bunch of them today and maybe tomorrow it will be better.

 

Also, now that I understand better how card and pack trading works it doesn't seem as bad to me as it first seemed. (I didn't get any EX card in my 10+ first free boosters so I thought they weren't available in them, but I  was just unlucky). Otherwise, I am entirely willing to put some money into the game so it makes things easier.

 

Having Themed tournaments which reward tradable packs is a nice bonus, I'll check those next week then.

 

----

 

I sill hate the whole concept of EX cards but there isn't much to do I guess.

 

My biggest complaint is that I can't test my random experiment decks against other players, as there doesn't seem to be any "casual" versus mode. But as I have said I'll try to loose a bunch of versus games and not play themed ones today and I'll see tomorrow if it's better.

 

---

 

So thanks again for the helpful comment.

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I had the same problem starting out.  It was either Theme decks or get beat.

 

What has changed for me?

 

1. I found web sites where I could buy codes for the game, pennies on the dollar compared to what you would pay at the department store.  I can't post web links here, so use google, or send just about any experienced person a pm.  I used every promo that I got the kids for Christmas and a few I got online very cheaply. 

 

example: I bought the kids the xerneas vs yveltal deck, then later added the promo codes I got cheaply for the ex's of these.  the xerneas deck basically has the bones of a competitive fairy deck.  and the yveltal deck isn't horrible, it's better than the theme decks and that's why you can't use it there.

 

2. reading web sites, blogs, vlogs, and googling deck lists.  basically researching the game and building what I desired based on that.

 

3. study the trade in game trade forum and master it.

I don't just open my booster packs anymore.  I either buy them cheaply online (the codes are really cheap) or I collect the ones the games give me and trade for exactly what I want.

 

I've built just about every deck that I've wanted so far and i started playing this as a way to research for Christmas shopping for the kids pokemon obsession.  yes, yes, I am the coolest dad ever.

 

This is good advice. Unfortunately the fastest route to getting good cards is to buy pack codes and start trading for cards you need. I invested about $10 and in a month I had a standard deck that was capable of winning matches. I make that distinction, because you don't necessarily need a tier 1 deck. Those can be expensive and most of those cards are in high demand.

 

My first standard deck was Blastoise EX/Greninja EX. It took about 1 month to get the cards to built it. It was in no way a top deck, but it won me games and got me tokens, tickets and packs that helped me eventually build a solid deck. In my case I took a deck from a previous season that I liked and people thought was dead after rotation and found a way to make it viable with some new cards from Primal Clash. That deck is still my winning-est deck in versus matches and the only one I play in tournaments.

 

As stated use the resources available on the internet and don't get discouraged.

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If you have money, you can buy booster pack codes on ****, and trade the claimed unopened booster packs for good cards, that's what I did.

You could do that, or open the less valuable ones, so you cam possibly get the good cards, and trade for even better cards.

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one good thing about buying codes.  once you've built the decks you really like, there really isn't anything to spend money for really.  so although it's addictive, I probably won't buy any more pack codes until it's time to make a double dragon mega Rayquaza deck when the next series comes out in May.

Edited by danielpeebles
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So is ebutuoy and I believe elgoog. For some reason they don't link linking to or mentioning any other ********

****************************************************************** to anything that could be interpreted as a ****

 

*********

 

*********

 

**************

 

****

 

Let's try ************* and see what happens.

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wow. even spaces and dashes in between letters of popular locations on the internet are blocked. And anything that precedes the (punctuation) dot and word-fragment com(puter).  

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wow. even spaces and dashes in between letters of popular locations on the internet are blocked. And anything that precedes the (punctuation) dot and word-fragment com(puter).  

 

If you were wondering what was censored in the title of this thread, it's the word "Ex". Apparently you can't put it after a "(".

 

- Concerning the matchmaking system:

I lost about 20 games yesterday, and today I was still matched against full Ex, full foil decks I could have never beaten with any casual deck. Maybe there simply isn't enough new players and the few ones are automatically matched against old ones.

 

However I managed to buy some packs and got myself a good Dark March deck. Since then I won more than 90% of my games. Actually I am full of tradable packs from the tournaments so I'll probably be able to get a more expensive deck now.

 

My point still kinda stands:

I am lucky I have both some money and a lot of experience with TCC's, but I pity other new players.

It would be great if there was some training PVP zone where you could battle other new players, and which you couldn't enter anymore once you have done X amount of game or spent X days in it. Or any other "newbie protection system".

 

Another thing I regret is that now I am kinda forced to only play this single deck (or other top decks once I will be able to make them). What I enjoy a lot in TCC's is to experiment with new things. We don't really have the opportunity to do it in this game. (I guess you could not care about your ELO and just play with your test decks in the regular VS queue, but you will get beaten so hard repeatedly it won't even be funny). 

 

Don't get me wrong there are a lot of things this game does amazingly well; offering so much free stuff for noobies for a starter. However IMO the most fun and the main reason to play TCC's will always be PVP, and not enough emphasis is put on "casual" play. (coupled with the fact that there is a huge gap between the good and the bad cards/decks)

Edited by deathzolth
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We had a casual play mode once, but it was removed because some players would go there with stuff like VirGen looking for easy wins. Tbh it isn't easy to set up an area where newer players can just go to play whatever there want. Deciding on the criteria for banning a card is what makes it so difficult.

 

Time or games played might work.

Edited by Rakkis157
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