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Non-Pokemon TCG Online suggestions


turquoise17

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In the Nintendo DS and Nintendo 3DS games, Ice-type Pokémon were strong against Ground-type Pokémon but exactly the opposite is happening in the card game due to Ground-type Pokémon being under the Fighting energy type. I figured if we brought the new Ice energy type on the table, it would help balance the card game a little more. Also, the overpowered Dragon energy type would be a little weaker with Fairy and Ice being involved, so it can finally have its own energy cards.

 

The idea is this: Minor Ice attacks would only require Ice energy cards but are not strong against certain energy types. To do attacks that are strong against the said energy type, Water energy cards would be required. That way, it would be possible for Ice Pokémon to cover weaknesses but it would be a little difficult. This was inspired by the fact that Ice-type Pokémon can learn Water-type moves to cover their weakness against Fire-type Pokémon.

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When I saw two-part legends in the HGSS set, I was amazed. That was because it provided a new way to play the card game. It was not one card being overpowered, but one card rather being one half of a larger card, and requiring the other half to play it. When a legend was played, the two cards were fit together like a puzzle. The recent legends gave two prize cards when knocked out, so it made sense because that meant two cards being worth two cards.

 

I was heavily disappointed when I heard that EX cards were back because the EX cards were just completely OP compared to the two-part legends. Also, that meant one card was worth two cards, which did not really make sense. Plus the EX cards eliminated the new way to play the card game, which was very disappointing.

 

I knew the two-part legends were not very viable, so I thought of a solution.

 

The solution is to have the cards fit horizontally. Now I say that because I think the two-part legends should be back, but each half should be playable. That way the player could simply play the first half and then wait for the other half to pop into his/her hand. By the time the player plays the other half, the two halves would combine into a stronger two-part legend, probably a two-part legend that is even more viable than EX cards. There is even an achievement saying we have to play a two-part legend, so the new legends would count.

 

We could even bring in a mix-and-match feature, where any of the left halves would fit to any right half. Then we could determine which half is compatible with which by type and the attacks the halves could do.

 

Until then, I do think EX cards should be banned for the reason explained above, unless there is a way to balance it all while still bringing back either the two-part legends, the new kind of two-part legends, or something similar that would bring a new kind of gameplay.

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Oh, I just thought of an idea. We could do this to other energy types like Fire, for example. Attacks that are more powerful and can affect certain energy types such as Water would require Grass energy cards, just like Ice cards needing Water energy cards for powerful attacks.

 

In order for the Ice energy type to actually be truly balanced, I think the Ground energy and Flying energy should also be introduced, each with its own energy cards.

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This may sound like a discussion thread, and it partly is, but this message is targeting mainly the real trading card game tournaments.

 

I know this may sound a little silly, but all I ask is this.

 

I would like to see videos of an official trading card game worldwide tournament where real damage counters and coins are used instead of dice. Maybe the coin can be a coin-flipping application on a phone for true 50/50 odds and to prevent the coin from going all over the place, but I still would like to see official coins and damage counters in action, even if that coin is an official coin-flipping Android app that I would love to get for free. I would like to see the coin and cardboard damage counters finally in action in the finals of an official worldwide tournament.

 

Now, the reason why I ask for this is mainly because of the fact that I have seen dice being used when the cards and the official rules clearly stated that coins are to be used. I know dice are used instead because coins can fly everywhere but at the same time, it still does not seem right. The rules said to use a coin, so we really should use a coin, or at least a coin-flipping application. As for the damage counters, I noticed I could probably understand the game better if the official damage counters were used and the camera was different and zooming in a little bit so I can read all the cards.

 

The point I am trying to make is that a coin should be used because it clearly said in the rulebook and the cards that a coin is to be used. The same goes to the damage counters. There are official damage counters, although they are made out of cardboard, so we should use them.

 

Please do not treat this thread as if it were a joke.

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The rulebooks also dictate that any handy object may suffice. This includes currency (pennies, nickels, etc.), dice (I wouldn't mind trying some polyhedral), and even psuedo-random generators (coin-flip simulators). At one time, official decks included glass beads as damage counters. While I do have a bag of damage counters and a nice assortment of coins, I prefer dice since there is little hassle in moving them (these darned fat fingers of mine) or cleaning up (imagine that bag of counters being dumped on a floor). Largely, I think of the tokens as something to illustrate the game to beginning players. And the amount of damage counters some of those tournament matches would need...

 

Oddly enough, when the world tournaments were over, I suggested on these forums for us to purchase a die item in the shop and attach it to decks like a coin for it to replace that and damage counters. I suppose that our viewpoints would be total opposites on the matter.

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yea I would say dice works quite well as damamge counters, just so much easier to turn the dice to add numbers then finding from the large pile of cardboard counters. having bought the elite trainer boxes which comes with their own special dice it really does work quite well.i used to play with pennies and the old glass beads but it gets hard holding 15 pennies on a single pokemon, and probs hard for opponent to count how much hp is left. problem with glass beads is just sometimes you get confused with the amount of dmg each counter represented.

 

i recently bought the red genesect collection which comeswith those cardboard counters and wihtin a month they've already started to show their age, not to mention the hassle of having to switch out x5 of the 10damage counters for x1 of the 50 damage counters just to make sure you have enough counters to go about.

 

overall i don't think its a big deal whichever is used but i myself would prefer a damage counter thats easy to read and handle as well as last at least a decent amount of time.

 

in regards to coin, i run the red genesect coin which i much prefer over the dice, just feels more authentic flipping a coin but i'm fine either way

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Please don't say that EX cards rule or anything biased, for that matter.

 

so claiming ex to be op isn't biased?

 

in any case with mega evolutions for ex coming out in X &Y it doesn't seem like the exs are going anywhere anytime soon. if anything we might be seeing ex take over as the new way of playing the game.

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Generally, I find the weakness/resistance labels to currently sate my tactical needs, though I do see where you are coming from. Perhaps a form of recognition between the two much like how Dragon became separate from Colorless.

 

It would also be nice to use an Ice Beam on a Grass-type and do double damage rather than have the move weakened. A cool-blue card with the image of a snowflake or crystal could make all the difference. As for Ground and Rock-types, they seem to be doing well enough as is. Unless an Ice-type is added into the TCG, many of the cards based on the earthy elements or are of flying Pokémon appear to have fair weakness/resistance labels. A flying Pokémon's case would simply be to make cards with a new weakness.

 

In regards to your thoughts on using multiple energy types such as Grass in a Fire attack either as a requirement or cost, similar effects on cards do already exist and are quite enjoyable to see when used in the proper decks. If you mean something along the lines of "Discard two Grass Energy to ignore the Defending Pokémon's resistance.", then I would not be surprised to see something like that down the line if it is not already available.

 

Multi-typed cards would be a little tricky. They had a short run in the R/S era, but didn't do much in the ways of affecting the weakness/resistance; just cards with a notice that their attacks did two kinds of damage. If it were attacks being typed, it would be the same matter as some are now being considered multi-typed as well. With many of the mechanics in the game, multi-typing cards could become needlessly complex so things are best left with different versions of a Pokémon.

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That is why I suggest the game have an option for "Classic" and "Advanced" deck rules, so players can have the choice of playing with staged Pokémon, like we are taught, or use the EX and Megas, which appear to be the only competitive option. It sounds better than shifting our eyes when selecting novice or expert, where you'll get the same kinds of people and decks. With deck rules, our opponent could instead be found with some automated process based on statistics or ratings of some kind while the population split would ideally be the same.

 

Unfortunately, those suggestions tend to have their thread closed with a notice that the developers do not want to separate players.

 

 

Adding on to previous comments, it isn't bias if it is pointing out the blatant. The chance to bring back a form of Lv.X cards in a way to even the playing field was instead spent on empowering rare cards that did not need it and expanding a gap between players. I don't blame the mods or devs, as they don't make those calls, but this is a bad deal.

 

Again, I know the developers don't want to separate us, but the cards are starting to do it themselves.

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Adding on to previous comments, it isn't bias if it is pointing out the blatant.

 

I think there are people who would argue otherwise.

 

also i'd like to add that it seems to often be the older players who are used to old playstyles that are finding exs hard to accept. My opinion is that they're just reluctant to accept new changes and are more comfortable playing the way they have played for years. unfortunately this forum was only created in the recent years, would be nice to have seen the same complains about the old legends cards back in their time as well as the lv.X and various other cards considered to be "overpowered". EX cards have been released in 6 expansions so far with quite a few being reprinted in the recent set, I don't see why people are still complaining about them rather than try and just deal with it.

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For coins, I like a little weight but don't feel like explaining what side means what. For that, I usually just keep a couple gold dollars in my pocket and hope my thumb doesn't aim one off the table. Those plastic coins are so deceptively light that I either flick too hard or the coin just flops off of my hand.

 

Ever run into someone that didn't know what the glass beads were? Kind of awkward. I remember a lot of kids asking if I took them out of a fish tank. It didn't help that I had a water deck at the time. Third grade was tough...

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I believe that the others weren't so antagonized because of the increased difficulty in playing them. Legends required two cards before they could be played and you could only have two full copies, making it hard to play one and have time to set up energy. Lv.X was similar to an evolution in that it had to be played on a specific card, usually one that has already evolved, again bringing in the set-up. Dark/Light Pokémon balanced each other with their health and attack values, were evolutions, and being as common as any other card, even being the base of theme decks.

 

Pokémon EX, on the other hand, could be played straight from your hand, required energy on the level of a normal card, and are usually stronger than any non-EX card. The only penalty being two prizes if it is managed to knock one out. Megas will give a small window to counter, yes, but with the massive health and attack, players will likely have to run a similar strategy of heavy EX use along with an odd handful of anti-EX cards.

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honestly I feel what exs are offering is basically a slightly better card than your typical stage 2 but without the hassle of evolving them. but with the exception of a few, most of them require non-ex for them to be truly dangerous:

 

Keldeo EX, Kyurem EX(PB) and Black Kyurem EX are no threat without Blastoise

Rayquaza EX needs Emboar

Darkrai needs Sableye

 

all those EX are won't be attacking until ~3 turns of energy attachment on their own, leaving ample time for their hp to be knocked down to normal levels, and even then some of those EX require energy to be discarded making them a 1 trick pony without their non-ex support.

 

and then we have all the other EX that nobody even bothers with like the original black and white kyurem EXs, the latios exs, the cresselia exs, dialga ex, palkia ex, zekrom ex, reshiram ex, ho-oh ex

 

and then you have the EX that would've been real cool but have less hp than your typical stage 2 who are literally begging to be knocked out in 1 hit by the uncommon Bouffalant like victini ex, celebi ex, mew ex, shaymin ex, jirachi ex

 

if you played a deck with only the listed exs on top you might look scary to a novice but aside from them nobody is gonna think you're "overpowered", even if we exclude the klingklang and safeguard matchups.

 

 

instead why not try petition the cards that are empowering these EXs? bring in a new blastoise and get rid of the old, ban the energy switches and dark patches, remove those rare candies so they can't get those stage 2 out so quickly to boost those exs? also pretty sure getting rid of colress machine will solve the plasma ex problem too.

 

Basically I'm saying that EXs in general are not op, they're slightly better but still need support to really work, and so don't blame it all on the ex, some part of the blame needs to go to their synergy with other cards.

 

Lastly I will say that there are a small list of ex cards that I do find rather overpowered but I don't think its fair for all EXs to be banned just because a couple of them are overpowered.

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Ever considered why I mentioned coin-flip applications? Also by damage counters I mean the ones from Black and White theme decks. No, other items other than coins should not suffice because I'm talking about official tournaments! That's why I mentioned virtual coins because they are still coins and if they are made by the official card game company they would be official.

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Didn't you hear what I said? I'm calling for new forms of gameplay! Being able to play a card right away would be nice, but that would be too standard, and I'm trying to avoid standard gameplay. Once again, I mentioned a new form of two-part legends where each half is playable by itself. I also mentioned the possibility of a mix-and-match feature. That has never been done before. Think about it.

 

so claiming ex to be op isn't biased?

in any case with mega evolutions for ex coming out in X &Y it doesn't seem like the exs are going anywhere anytime soon. if anything we might be seeing ex take over as the new way of playing the game.

 

One, I meant EX cards are OP for a single card. By that I mean they are too powerful that the only sure-fire way to counter them is to use EX cards ourselves. That should be obvious. With cards that OP the difficulty to play them should be increased, but it should show visual differences, too. It should be played differently, just like two-part legends where two cards are placed on top of each other horizontally instead of one card being played normally.

 

Two, EX cards are still single cards, and they are not introducing any new form of gameplay at all.

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The route I'm going for is a new move specifically for the card game.

 

For example, let's say an Ice-type Beartic was put in play, with the new Ice energy type already introduced.

 

It would have one attack where only Ice energy cards are needed.

 

The other attack would be, say, Surf, that needs two Ice energy cards and two Water energy cards. It would deal double the damage against Fire-type cards and the resistance would not apply. We could even say in the card, "This attack is a Water-type attack." if we wanted to.

 

As for the colour, I was planning for something like this colour. I don't know the hex code, but it says "turquoise" on the palette. I even thought of a separate symbol to go with it. Basically it's a snowflake with an arrow circling around it.

 

I did say the Ground energy type should be introduced because Ground acts a little differently from the Fighting energy type. We might as well have sixteen different energy types for the sake of differentiation. We could have muddy green for Bug and use a symbol that looks like a ladybug. Ghost could be a darker purple than Psychic and can be represented by a candlestick. Poison could be more of a wine-red and can be represented by a similar symbol used by the Toxic Badge. Flying could be a light purple and can be represented by an angel wing.

 

Maybe I'm looking too deep into this... Maybe Ice is enough, but I'm still thinking of having it use turquoise and be represented by a snowflake and an arrow circling around it.

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well then the elite trainer boxes don't give you coins, they give you a bunch of dice and a bigger dice to use for coin flips. Isn't that a sign that the card game company is endorsing the use of the dice as coin replacements?

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it seems your definition of new gameplay is only for new cards that can be played differently. I don't believe that's true, while the standard trainer, pokemon, and energy cards have been standard in the card game, the way they have been used has changed quite a lot of the introduction of each set and/or rule changes, I think it would be too narrow minded to think that only a fancy new gameplay mechanic would siffice as "new gameplay"

 

again i would also like to reiterate that the EX cards are just slightly more powerful than your standard non-evolving basic or final evolution stage pokemon, the reason they are thought to be overpowered by most people is because of their synergy with other cards, they themselves alone are not as dangerous and do not require EXs to take them down. Please try and built a complete EX deck and play in expert modified, you may exclude losses you incurred from safeguard decks, let me know of the results. If you by any chance managed a good outcome let me know the deck build as I'd like to test it out for myself.

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The point I'm trying to make to the card game company is that doing so does not make any sense. There are coin flip applications in phones now. The card game company could make one and have the tournament participants use that instead.

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it seems your definition of new gameplay is only for new cards that can be played differently. I don't believe that's true, while the standard trainer, pokemon, and energy cards have been standard in the card game, the way they have been used has changed quite a lot of the introduction of each set and/or rule changes, I think it would be too narrow minded to think that only a fancy new gameplay mechanic would siffice as "new gameplay"

 

Let me make myself clear. Fancy schmancy new gameplay mechanic was exactly what I meant by "new gameplay". Maybe I should have used that, but the point I am trying to get across is that new kinds of cards should be played differently visual-wise. Without such new gameplay mechanics the games would not be very interesting except to the card game fans because every single card is played normally. There is not a way to distinguish which cards are special without having a closer look at them. Besides, there has to be a way for everyone to earn the "Legendary Trainer" achievement more easily, and EX cards won't do, because if they did, they would ruin the point of playing an actual two-part legend, which itself is an achievement. Kudos for the Trainer cards to develop, but that just would not suffice.

 

again i would also like to reiterate that the EX cards are just slightly more powerful than your standard non-evolving basic or final evolution stage pokemon, the reason they are thought to be overpowered by most people is because of their synergy with other cards, they themselves alone are not as dangerous and do not require EXs to take them down. Please try and built a complete EX deck and play in expert modified, you may exclude losses you incurred from safeguard decks, let me know of the results. If you by any chance managed a good outcome let me know the deck build as I'd like to test it out for myself.

 

Maybe I should have rephrased myself to prevent misinterpretation. By OP I meant that EX cards alone can deal too much damage for a single card, and so I do think the difficulty of playing them should increase. I really liked the two-part legend idea because playing them is a little more challenging. Of course, EX cards would not sound that dangerous because knocking out one of them would mean getting two prize cards, and their attacks usually require more than one energy card.

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Per the description of this sub-forum:

 

Let us know what you think about the Pokémon TCG Online. There's always room for improvement!

 

As these suggestions are not specific to the Pokémon TCG Online, I am locking this thread as off-topic.

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