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Fair Trade


NinetynineTails

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So I bought myself 2 Legendary Treasures Booster Packs(using Tokens) and realised that I can't actually trade them at all.

First of all, if it's going to be that way it should be clearly indicated to anyone considering spending their hard-earned Tokens; if that information had been made available to me - as it should have - then I would have spent my tokens on a theme deck.

Back when the Beta was in it's earlier stages I earned some cards which are still trade-able to this day. I see no reason for this to have changed or any prominent place where this is noted.

 

If the Online Pokemon Trading Card Game is going to be advertised as free to play, then doesn't it stand to reason that trading cards, the operative words in TCG, should be free? As it is you can only trade something you've payed for.

To be fair to everyone who's played for serious lengths of time in order to earn Tokens, I think trading cards should be viable regardless of what method was used to obtain them. This would enhance the trading experience for paying members, also, as they would be able to find the cards they're after with less difficulty. Apart from that it would encourage more people to play, including some who just want to invest a bit of money to get themselves started.

 

For the record, I'm not referring to freely rewarded packs, from daily rewards, trainer challenge etc, just the cards that are bought with Tokens.

 

Anyway, I do have an alternate suggestion that might be a little more appealing to the Pokemon Company in terms of revenue: Create a 'Trading License' that allows users to trade their token-bought cards. This would be something that could be purchased with either Tokens or Gems.

It would allow entry level players with a bit of cash to invest in something constant and reliable, rather than just relying on some boosters to provide trade fodder.

It would reward hardcore players who have already poured money into the game with new trade opportunities and more challenging opponents.

It would keep frugal folk like myself from giving up on the game due to the sheer difficulty in making a new deck. I may buy something someday, but that won't happen if I've given up on the game already.

It will enhance trading for everyone, as well as the decks we play with and the quality of gameplay.

 

Yours truly, Nine. Peace.

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Unfortunately even if dev team wanted to allow us to unlock free trade-able cards spending tokens on the shop they actually cannot do that because users with more accounts going to start trade themselves!! Is truth the most people disappointing that there is no any other way except to buy cards with original money in order to trade with these cards!! Only if dev team figure out how to stop these users who use more than one account to trade themselves then there is no any other reason why dev team not add free trade-able cards on the game!!

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Unfortunately even if dev team wanted to allow us to unlock free trade-able cards spending tokens on the shop they actually cannot do that because users with more accounts going to start trade themselves!! Is truth the most people disappointing that there is no any other way except to buy cards with original money in order to trade with these cards!! Only if dev team figure out how to stop these users who use more than one account to trade themselves then there is no any other reason why dev team not add free trade-able cards on the game!!

Well if you read my other proposal you'd realise that wouldn't work if the Tokens necessary for a Trading License were equivalent to -or higher than - the total amount of Tokens able to be earnt through all of the Trainer Challenges. That wouldn't entirely account for Daily Rewards being used, but that could be easily fixed if they were changed to consist of a random low-rarity card(that being a free card rather than Token-bought, ie still not trade-able under the revised system I'm proposing). Perhaps make them Common on most days, with the occasional Uncommon or Rare rather than the 5 cards packs, so it's still similar value to the current rewards.

 

Something the Dev team could do - or should be able to - is create an IP lock on accounts so that each internet connection can only have one. Wouldn't be necessary if there were nothing to profit by from multiple accounts as reviewed in my above paragraph, but depending on how things end up it would make exploits harder to do.

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I don't think limiting accounts would be the answer, true it would help to prevent duplication but it would also cause issues for households with more than one person gaming. I guess they could all share the same account but still that may cause problems with trading. I do feel that boosters purchased with Tokens should be tradeable though or at least the boosters one acquires from the 12 wins with theme decks. I understand what you mean as I too cannot afford many packs or pack codes and have come across many players that cannot get cards in their country or online. The problem as I understand it is tat the free cards were abused through players creating multiple accounts, going through TC and then trading cards from one account to the other, they then used those cards to trade and did not need to buy 1 real life booster pack. Which is great for us lol but would be a problem for the company. What might be an idea would be to have 2 types of booster packs, the free ones that are locked which can be purchased with 95 tokens or another tradeable set that has a higher token cost or can be purchased with Gems, though not too many gems I would hope. It would also be good if the older packs, currently no longer available due to booster credits being discontinued, could be reintegrated for Gems. This would enable newer players to get those cards they missed out on should they wish to.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Yeh, the limiting accounts thing was just a stop-gap I threw in there in case the main idea isn't fully realised or is completed in stages.

 

As for exploitation of the idea itself, it's simply not possible, as I explained to Sara. The Trader's license wouldn't leave you with any Trainer Challenge Tokens to spend on tradeable cards; you'd be dependent on earnt ones to actually have anything to trade across, meaning it can't be exploited as you could just earn those on your original account in the first place.

 

There are already 2 types of Boosters. Legendary Treasures is tradeable(just not when Token-bought) as are the Boosters obtained with Booster credits, but the 5-card boosters are not(no matter the method of purchase). Theme deck cards are never trade-able either, as I'm sure you're aware and for obvious reasons.

 

I do, however, agree that any Booster you earnt from using a bought Theme pack should also be tradeable. Thanks for picking up on that.

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I completely agree that they shouldn't make the 95 token booster packs or the ones you get from daily rewards tradeable since it's going to be easy to make use of by creating multiple accounts.

 

I do think some of the free packs you can earn should be tradeable though. I'm mainly thinking of the ones you get after getting 4 stars against all opponents in a single cup. If someone truly is patient enough to keep creating new accounts and playing that many games just to get 3 tradeable booster packs I definitely think they've deserved them.

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There are super easy ways to get around some of these issues. The point is the bottom line, period. I have no problem spending money to play a game, I've spent 75$ on this game in the last month, I agree that "locked" cards are fundamentally lame. It's a trading card game, and if you can't trade...really its "look at some virtual cards" game. You can't play against other players seriously without trading so you are left in a pay-to-win scenario. I feel like booster are appropriately expensive at 195 coin for 10 cards, you get 1 coin for playing a 5 min match that's 16.25 hours if you were to convert it to man hours, assuming maximum efficiency (no que time, every match ends at exactly 5 min... etc) The daily bonus helps, so does the trainer challenge for a short period, but truth is coins are not easy to get. I feel as though there would be ways to keep things balanced and fun. We don't even need to use things like IP checking (though I don't know why such a system isn't in place.) I simply think having two types of coins would make the game balanced and rewarding.

 

Here is what I suggest, keep certain coins as 'locked' coins, things like the daily bonus, getting to the third star on the trainer challenge etc. Then have other coins that can be used to redeem unlockable packs, and keep these to things like battling, tournament prizes, and maybe clearing ******* league in trainer challenge. I think this will do several positive things -

 

1. It will encourage everyone to battle more, not just people with super Over Powered decks looking to show off, but the little guys working their way up, see some deck variety instead of just the 5 guys who spent 2,000 dollars to make the perfect deck.

 

2. I feel it will create a larger community. I showed this game to my friend, he loved it, but after he found out he couldn't trade he just dropped it. It's daunting to think how much money you have to spend to even be competitive PVP, and he's the kinda guy who spends money on online games, but there is too much of a wall for new players.

 

3. Have you cake and eat it too! Some players will still choose to buy cards with money, and if there are more players that pool will grow, if earning coins is hard enough it may make more sense.

 

4. Increase the trading pool. Right now there are a few dozen guys who have most the cards and often want to hang onto them, so there is a really tight market, if we have more trading options it will create a stronger community.

 

Overall, I think if the coins are regulated correctly the system would work well, if all the "tradeable" coins have to be earned through hours of battling it doesn't matter if someone makes 4 accounts if you aren't giving them out for free. I think its fine for the store to exist, and I think a company should make money, but be creative! Things like cool deck boxes, play mats, and coins can be left for cash but give the little guy a chance. You might be surprised what happens, look at League of Legends, they don't charge anything for their game, they just have cash options and they rake in the money because the gamers are appreciative.

 

TLDR: Have two types of coins one for "unlockable" one for "locked". Keep "unlockable" coins hard to earn in battles. Have more cash options, see the community flourish.

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I completely agree that they shouldn't make the 95 token booster packs or the ones you get from daily rewards tradeable since it's going to be easy to make use of by creating multiple accounts.

 

I do think some of the free packs you can earn should be tradeable though. I'm mainly thinking of the ones you get after getting 4 stars against all opponents in a single cup. If someone truly is patient enough to keep creating new accounts and playing that many games just to get 3 tradeable booster packs I definitely think they've deserved them.

 

Actually didn't say it should be that way, only that it currently is. Not bothered if they change that or not, but I think it would be better if the 5 card boosters were actually trade-able. If anything it should be the opposite of what it is now; then the most recent Booster would be untradeble while the older Modified Legal packs are. That way the newly released pack gets better sales without online players just saving up Tokens or trading for the cards and not bothering to buy the real ones.

 

I think you're underestimating how easy the Trainer Challenge is to clock for someone who's already done it before. 3 Boosters is worth about 600 Tokens. I could do the Trainer Challenge way faster than I could earn 600 Tokens by conventional means. Yes, it could be exploited, and yes, some people would do so, but that wouldn't be fair on the law-abiding Pokemon player. It's also a matter of principle; there shouldn't be any way of exploiting multiple accounts simply because it's still exploitation. It doesn't set a good precedent.

 

There are super easy ways to get around some of these issues. The point is the bottom line, period. I have no problem spending money to play a game, I've spent 75$ on this game in the last month, I agree that "locked" cards are fundamentally lame. It's a trading card game, and if you can't trade...really its "look at some virtual cards" game. You can't play against other players seriously without trading so you are left in a pay-to-win scenario. I feel like booster are appropriately expensive at 195 coin for 10 cards, you get 1 coin for playing a 5 min match that's 16.25 hours if you were to convert it to man hours, assuming maximum efficiency (no que time, every match ends at exactly 5 min... etc) The daily bonus helps, so does the trainer challenge for a short period, but truth is coins are not easy to get. I feel as though there would be ways to keep things balanced and fun. We don't even need to use things like IP checking (though I don't know why such a system isn't in place.) I simply think having two types of coins would make the game balanced and rewarding.

 

Here is what I suggest, keep certain coins as 'locked' coins, things like the daily bonus, getting to the third star on the trainer challenge etc. Then have other coins that can be used to redeem unlockable packs, and keep these to things like battling, tournament prizes, and maybe clearing ******* league in trainer challenge. I think this will do several positive things -

 

1. It will encourage everyone to battle more, not just people with super Over Powered decks looking to show off, but the little guys working their way up, see some deck variety instead of just the 5 guys who spent 2,000 dollars to make the perfect deck.

 

2. I feel it will create a larger community. I showed this game to my friend, he loved it, but after he found out he couldn't trade he just dropped it. It's daunting to think how much money you have to spend to even be competitive PVP, and he's the kinda guy who spends money on online games, but there is too much of a wall for new players.

 

3. Have you cake and eat it too! Some players will still choose to buy cards with money, and if there are more players that pool will grow, if earning coins is hard enough it may make more sense.

 

4. Increase the trading pool. Right now there are a few dozen guys who have most the cards and often want to hang onto them, so there is a really tight market, if we have more trading options it will create a stronger community.

 

Overall, I think if the coins are regulated correctly the system would work well, if all the "tradeable" coins have to be earned through hours of battling it doesn't matter if someone makes 4 accounts if you aren't giving them out for free. I think its fine for the store to exist, and I think a company should make money, but be creative! Things like cool deck boxes, play mats, and coins can be left for cash but give the little guy a chance. You might be surprised what happens, look at League of Legends, they don't charge anything for their game, they just have cash options and they rake in the money because the gamers are appreciative.

 

TLDR: Have two types of coins one for "unlockable" one for "locked". Keep "unlockable" coins hard to earn in battles. Have more cash options, see the community flourish.

 

Well I hope they would be called something other than 'locked coins', but that idea would work too. Your predicted effects on the community and franchise are similar to my own speculations. Glad to hear a paying player agrees it would improve the game for all involved.

 

The best option may be just to make Gems the currency that's earned in Multiplayer rather than Tokens. May require a slight reimbursement to those with Gems already upon implementation(as they would have bought Gems expecting them to only ever be obtained through purchase), but it would be good in the long term IMO. Very little effort in regards to programming though, I would expect.

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if they made a 5 card trade-able pack for 195 tokens that would work... you would decrease the chance of having a super rare and also make people work for those cards, in order to stop trading cheats. Not like you will ever stop cheaters though, but, if you make them turn their laziness into work, they will either quit or become better, fairer players.

 

p.s. it's impossible without tokens that you only earn through PVP

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if they made a 5 card trade-able pack for 195 tokens that would work... you would decrease the chance of having a super rare and also make people work for those cards, in order to stop trading cheats. Not like you will ever stop cheaters though, but, if you make them turn their laziness into work, they will either quit or become better, fairer players.

 

p.s. it's impossible without tokens that you only earn through PVP

 

Actually, it wouldn't work. If it doesn't prevent people immediately trading those cards across accounts it can be abused. With as many Tokens as you get from clocking the Trainer Challenge you'd still be able to get a pack or two to trade. At that level of difficulty it could still be a problem as it usually takes a couple hundred Multiplayer games to get that many(compared to one hundred or so AI battles which are much quicker). You can stop multiple account abuse, as I've already explained, so why risk it? Even if it is inconvenient there's no reason to make it possible in the first place. Why accommodate for anyone who wants to abuse the system? Assuming they're all too lazy to bother is just stereotyping.

 

Guess you could have a larger, more expensive pack of trade-able cards(so it's not to be purchasable with all the Tokens in the Trainer Challenge) but it would still be easier to get one on an extra account than with a current one so you're basically just punishing those who actually earn their Tokens properly.

 

The simplest option would be to make Multiplayer matches award Gems instead of Tokens(and maybe fix the rewards system so it's not entirely dependant on the 5 minute rule to dictate rewards). I still think my original suggestion would add more to the game; though it does require Daily Rewards to be changed into free singles, rather than Token currency(which your suggestion would need also but would still leave the above loophole).

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Guest ArtichokeCat

What in the world is a gem? Just . Also, i agree about how difficult it is to make decks these days, even with the free 45 booster packs from the trainer challenge. Only the ones i got from the Gold League were any good. The rest wasn't very useful. Sigh.

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