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My lost march list


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13 January 2019 - 03:33 AM

#1

Sadra

    Senior Trainer

  • Sadra

My Lost March List in Expanded: Fun to Play and Easy to Master




When lost march came out, many of my friends tried to make it work in both standard and expanded but the deck faces a few problems:

1. just seemed too clunky since it ran a lot of mons

2. it seemed way to vulnerable to spread decks or bench damage due to the lost marchers’ low HP.

3. Not getting enough hoopips on turn 1 could result in falling behind the prize trade due to low damage imput.

4. Deck lacks consistency without suppoter EX/GX (shaymin, lele, jirachi). However, the player will get easily punished by a guzma and fall behind the prize trade once again.



I really wished to make it work since it seemed so fun to play. I found some decklists online including team fish knuckles no-jumpluff deck and Danny Treminio’s list that made top 44 in Anaheim’s regional. Team fish knuckles deck had an interesting concept as it is very similar to Connor’s Finton’s vespiquen/flareon decklist and aimed to go fast without evolving Hoopips but rather using exeggcute/lost blender combos to fuel up natu’s attack. However, the deck is very clunky and the damage output is usually way too low during the first or second turns and sometimes I think that it would be better to wait a turn rather than wasting a DCE and performing an attack that isn’t significant enough. Danny’s decklist was overall good but it lacked consistency and out of 3 games I played I dead-drawed 3. In addition, it is almost an auto-loss to spread decks (e.g. trevenant) and boy do you need to get lucky to avoid these matchups and get lucky without dead drawing. Danny’s decklist also has a lot of problematic choices such as playing one copy supporters (guzma, elm) without lele (I hardly believe you would draw that exact supporter you needed on that particular turn, other than turn 1 or 2, elm will remain as a garbage card for the rest of the game), no ways to retreat (seriously, this is really gambling), and being too greedy on damage (you really don’t need choice bands). I understand that this deck may never be able to cover everything due to its tight deck space but still, these decklists just seem a bit underwhelming to me. Don’t get me wrong, both team fish knuckles and Danny are awesome players, its just these decklists don’t work for me.

After playtesting for quite a while, this the final decklist I came up with :



****** Pokémon Trading Card Game Deck List ******



##Pokémon - 24



* 1 Oranguru SUM 113

* 4 Trumbeak LOT 165

* 1 Machop GRI 63

* 1 Machoke GRI 64

* 3 Hoppip LOT 12

* 1 Hoppip STS 3

* 4 Skiploom LOT 13

* 4 Jumpluff LOT 14

* 1 Marshadow SLG 45

* 3 Natu LOT 87

* 1 Tapu Lele-GX GRI 155



##Trainer Cards - 30



* 2 Net Ball LOT 234

* 1 Master Ball PLB 94

* 1 Super Rod DRV 20

* 2 Professor Juniper PLF 116

* 4 Great Ball SLG 60

* 4 Pokémon Communication BLW 99

* 1 Colress PLS 135

* 4 Level Ball AOR 76

* 2 Cynthia UPR 148

* 2 Guzma BUS 143

* 1 Brigette BKT 161

* 2 N NVI 101

* 3 Lost Blender LOT 233

* 1 Float Stone PLF 99



##Energy - 6



* 3 Grass Energy GRI 167

* 3 Double Colorless Energy GRI 166



Total Cards - 60



****** Deck List Generated by the Pokémon TCG Online www.pokemon.com/TCGO ******

Some choices of this deck are explained below:



1.Machop-Machoke line


Basically prevents all spread decks from sniping the bench. Of course, some people would say, why not play a giratina promo? This basically destroys the top 2 most aggressive spread decks (greninja, trevenant). The problem is many greninja decks run silent lab and in a deck that plays zero field blowers and stadiums, what’s the point? Although being a stage 1, which would take an additional turn to get out, machoke’s ability protects everything other than spell tag and in a decklist that maxes out communications and balls, it really isn’t difficult to get out on turn 2 when needed. Another potential and important use of this line is that it is great to put into the lost zone with blenders to fuel up attacks since many other pokemon in the deck may play an important role and sometimes you really don’t want to throw them in there.




2. 1-Tapulele


Just for the sake of consistency. You really want to get out a turn 1 brigette or get a draw supporter at crucial points of the game. Whether to bench the lele is highly situational and depends on the matchup. If your dealing with shrines or non-GX decks, you might want to hold on to it, but against many matchups (zoroark, rayquaza, buzzwole), it really doesn’t make that of a difference.




3.Brigette instead of Elm


In many games, oranguru is really important and you want to get it out ******** draw power. The main reason of playing elm is to get skiplooms but again, a deck with 4 levels, 4 greats, 4 communications never should struggle with this issue.




4.0 Vs seekers (Are you crazy?)


Yep, playing a deck without one of the most important and powerful cards in expanded seems like pure madness. If I could, I would. BUT, there are problems with running VS seekers:


1. Decks that have massive draw power and have measures of discarding supporters (e.g. UB) into the discard pile can take advantage of seekers whereas this deck that has limited options makes seekers pure garbage when drawn on early game with a hand of nothing.


2. To play seekers you have to first decrease the number of supporters you play and this increases the probability of dead drawing and thus you would heavily rely on orangurus, lele, and marshadows to get the cards you need. But remember, benching these not only makes losses to guzma (giving your opponent an extra turn) more possible but weakens your lost march as less hoopips would be benched.


Overall, you really need to conserve your resources when playing this deck and think through which supporter to play/fetch on each turn (especially those guzmas) since these cards, in a way, enter the lost zone after you play them.




5. 1 Float stone


As argued repetitively above, you really need to have methods of retreat sometimes without wasting energies. This could lead to losses in the late game.




6. 0 Timer Balls


My luck is genuinely bad and I never want the gamble on my luck. The general outcome of the timer ball is 1 heads, which I could achieve with levels. While you could get a awesome 2 heads from time to time, getting a never-lucky 2 tails on a critical turn could be devastating.



Advantages:

1. This deck has a great performance and trades well against many meta decks that play any GX’s (zoroark, seismitoad). Even against non GX/EX decks like night march, your opponent really has to think through about whether to bench that lele/shaymin or not to prevent a guzma knockout.

2. Quite consistent, based on my experience, you should be able to achieve a 150-180 damage by turn two and 220+ on turn 3.

3. Going first is nice but going second doesn’t hurt that much either. This is an important advantage of non GX/EX decks.



Disadvantages:

1. Almost an auto-loss against shuckle and rotom (IRL nobody plays rotom though). Probably a wise decision to tech in alolan muk.


2. Poor flexibility of supporter use due to zero vs seekers.


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13 January 2019 - 10:30 AM

#2

Felidae_

    Elite Trainer

  • Felidae_

I'll go ahead and ask the obvious: What happened to the 4th DCE :D?

 

For reference sake this is the highest placing Lost march list from Anaheim, piloted by Dany Treminio to a 44th place.

 

Pokemon - 23

4 Hoppip LOT 12

4 Skiploom LOT 13

4 Jumpluff LOT 14

4 Trumbeak LOT 165

4 Natu LOT 87

2 Marshadow SLG 45

1 Oranguru SUM 113

 

Trainer - 29

2 Professor Sycamore BKP 107

2 Lillie SUM 122

1 N FCO 105

1 Colress PLS 118

1 Guzma BUS 115

1 Professor Elm's Lecture LOT 188

4 Level Ball AOR 76

4 Great Ball SUM 119

3 Pokemon Communication BLW 99

3 Lost Blender LOT 181

3 VS Seeker PHF 109

1 Super Rod BKT 149

1 Computer Search BCR 137

2 Choice Band GRI 121

 

Energy - 8

4 Double Colorless Energy SUM 136

4 Grass Energy 1

 

I'm by no means an expert on the archetype, so most comments will be based on my initial gut feeling, rather than on plain experience.

 

I like the Tapu Lele a lot in your list, especially in a bo1 scenario. I can see how in a bo3 you can substitute Lele for the second Marshadow ( which has another benefit of having only non EX/GX Pokemon for the prize trade), though on PTCGO I'd stick with Lele as well.

 

Running only 3 Natu / DCE seems really odd. Given that Natu is the easist Pokemon in your deck that can deal the finishing blow without any kind of set-up, I can't understand why you wouldn't run the 4th copy. The same is true for the 4th DCE: in my experience decks like NM struggle a lot to take the final prize cards, especially after a well timed N. If you already reduce your own resources befor the match even starts, chances are that you are not going to draw that crucial energy in tiem to deliver the final punch.

 

Computer Search over Master Ball is a no-brainer.

 

What's your take on Choice Band? Running some numbers in my head I'd argue that the card can ensure a turn 1 / 2 OHKO, helps to thin your deck (to a degree), but then again space is tight in the list.

 

I can get behind the Machoke idea online.

 

Thanks for sharing your list, I'll definitely try to build the deck and test it out for myself :).


The shadows of the abyss are like the petals of a monstrous flower that shall blossom within the skull and expand the mind beyond what any man can bear, but whether it decays under the earth or above on green fields, or out to sea or in the very air, all shall come to revelation, and to revel, in the knowledge of the strangling fruit - and the hand of the sinner shall rejoice, for there is no sin in shadow or in light that the seeds of the dead cannot forgive...

 

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13 January 2019 - 11:10 AM

#3

Sadra

    Senior Trainer

  • Sadra

Hi there Felidae, its always nice to have an expert comment on my decklists ;) .

1. About natu, you make a really great point and it does seem like an odd choice at first since absolutely, it is the easiest pokemon to attack without basically any setup. The problem is that you would never need more than 2 natus actually, in a match (other than hitting weakness). This is because in order to boost damage, you would need at least 3 jumpluffs (other than getting prized 2 of the evolution line, which is quite rare) on the board and this is why I believe jumpluff is the main attacker since usually you would not attack if your damage output is low. During turn 1 or turn 2 (if you go second) sometimes if the damage output is not high enough (less than a 1/2 OHKO or not simply not worth it due to energy trades or other factors) I usually prefer to wait a turn. In addition, if you really need natu it should never be a problem to get it out using balls and communications. Super rod also recycles pokemon as well.

2. In terms of energy, the initial decklist I ran was 1 super boost, 3 grass, and 4 DCE, which was very similar of what you suggested. However, I found that I draw into them a lot and it impeded my setup (kindof :mellow: ). After some games, I found that since you would not be attacking on the first or second turn (depending who goes first) you should be able to thin out at least ****** your deck using blenders, balls, and communications and just like I said above, jumpluff is the main attacker in my opinion (also the main reason why I ran 2 net balls, not just for grabbing out hoppips but also getting access to that energy on turn, super rod also recycles energy). For the final prize cards, oranguru can help on the late time N, if there is not alolan muk or garbotoxin on board. 

3. Yep, your correct on computer search. Definitely a better choice I must be ***** when I was considering master ball.

4. Regarding choice band, it is always great to get it and hit hard early in the game but due to the tight deck space, I have to leave room for other cards.

5. In addition, I really want to add a copy of field blower because gosh those focus sashes are annoying.

Thanks for sharing your opinion ! 


Edited by Sadra, 13 January 2019 - 11:30 AM.

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