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Public Opinion on 'Guzma'


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30 October 2018 - 11:39 PM

#1

Cisqoe

    Rookie Trainer

  • Cisqoe

Chances are, this supporter card is in your deck. If not, your still going to run into it in just about every battle.

 

My question to everyone is... is this card too OP? Do you think it should be banned? 

What is everyone's general thoughts on the card?

 

Personally I think it should've been put into a kind of 'Ace Spec' grade where you get only one per deck.

The card is really useful obviously but it seems to stifle creativity and flow of play of most battles. 

Some decks I've seen really manipulate the rules of play to be able to use the card every turn or two but for the most part it seems okay.

 

Anyway, what's everyone elses thoughts? Can anyone defend the card?

:)

 

-EDIT-

Would love to hear interpretation of long time players on this


Edited by Cisqoe, 30 October 2018 - 11:40 PM.

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31 October 2018 - 12:25 AM

#2

WingsofFire1014

    Senior Trainer

  • WingsofFire1014
I have played since Guzma came out. It is a great card. I don't think it should be banned or become an Ace Spec because it adds a whole lot of strategy and it makes you rethink some parts of your deck when you go to make that part.

There is nothing wrong with manipulating Guzma. It is strategy that does it. Strategy is a great part of the whole game.

P.S. Do they even still make Ace Spec cards?
Try try again. Never ever quit.
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31 October 2018 - 12:34 AM

#3

XK920XK

    Veteran Trainer

  • XK920XK

i definitely think this card is needed, also similar cards cards like lysandre and counter catcher etc.

 

with this card it allowed players to pick at opponents bench, that bench may contain a pokemon with lots of energies or one that is about to be setup.  Without it, someone can just put a bulky or locking pokemon up front and get locked till deckout or watch as the opponent builds multiple huge bench pokes and get smashed at the end.

 

also, guzma enables players to get out of active lock, lets you get that fat 3-4 retreat cost pokemon out of your active.

 

guzma also enables players to finish off a damaged pokemon, lets say you hit someones huge 200+ hp pokemon down to 10-20 or 30 and they retreat, then all those attacks prior would of been basically for nothing. 


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31 October 2018 - 12:35 AM

#4

SonicDream

    Novice Trainer

  • SonicDream

I have played since Guzma came out. It is a great card. I don't think it should be banned or become an Ace Spec because it adds a whole lot of strategy and it makes you rethink some parts of your deck when you go to make that part.

There is nothing wrong with manipulating Guzma. It is strategy that does it. Strategy is a great part of the whole game.

P.S. Do they even still make Ace Spec cards?

No on the A-Spec cards since it was part of the Plasma sets, I doubt they would bring them back.

 

when it comes to Guzma being banned, I do not feel it is over powered. In fact I feel it is almost needed in against a lot of decks such as Trevenant in Expanded or Buzzwole in Standard. Having to deal with a Magcargo going off every turn without having Guzma might make that match up extremely complicated for players.

 

Before Guzma there was Lysandre and nobody felt it was busted. 


                         “The world as we have created it is a process of our thinking.       

                               It cannot be changed without changing our thinking.”                                                                - Albert Einstein

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31 October 2018 - 12:36 AM

#5

Sakura150612

    Elite Trainer

  • Sakura150612

I'm calling balanced on this one. It's pretty much just Lysandre 2.0 with an added effect (switching your own pokemon). It IS a powerful card but not so much that it deserves to be limited. It also acts as a strong counter to heavily setup-dependant decks (and depending on the deck you're running, it might be your only counter). I think having the option to run 2 Guzmas instead of 1 is fair. You're still making a strategical choice of having Guzma prized significantly less often (running 2) vs having your deck brick less often (running 1) (remember that a dead hand with a Guzma is still a dead hand). Youl'll pretty much never want to run 3 or 4 copies because you'll be filling your deck with bricks.

 

P.S. Do they even still make Ace Spec cards?

 

Nope, they stopped making them once XY came around, probably a bit earlier than that even. The closest thing we have to Ace Spec cards now is Prism Star cards, with the difference being that'd you'd be limited to a single copy of each PS card as opposed to a single PS card in the entire deck.


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31 October 2018 - 12:47 AM

#6

SuperStone

    Elite Trainer

  • SuperStone

I don't think he needs to be banned, no.  Certainly the card can be annoying, but I think it's much more fair than Lysandre was- despite the consensus generally being that Guzma is stronger.  But that doesn't seem to be what you're getting at, so I'll shift gears.

 

So you think that Guzma reduces creativity?  Interesting.  That's actually the opposite of my personal take on it.  Because it allows greater flexibility, I think the card makes many decks that otherwise would get stuck too often- with a bad pokemon active, or with no way to finish damaged pokemon on the opponent's bench- far more viable.  And that means the meta isn't dominated by extremely fast, basic, and synergistic decks that only deal in OHKOs.  I also think he adds another element of strategy- that you have to think about not just what pokemon are active, but also every one sitting on the bench.  And that's where he becomes annoying.  Some otherwise very nice strategies need to have specific pokemon on the bench- and keep them alive.  Oftentimes, these are pokemon quite difficult to get into play, and it gets really frustrating when your opponent just knocks them down whenever you get them out.  However, I think it's fair to say that none of those strategies would be tournament-competitive anyway, so while he remains a nuisance, this removes the primary reason to ban him.

 

Also, to clear up the Ace Spec question: they started in Boundaries Crossed, and others were released in the three Plasma expansions.  Legendary Treasures, the last Black and White set, contained none, and the concept ended with the B2W2 era that created it.


Edited by SuperStone, 31 October 2018 - 12:47 AM.

The truth waits for no one.  That which you refuse to see, TPCi, slips past you.  The chat function was never your problem, yet through your blindness, you have made it one.

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31 October 2018 - 07:26 PM

#7

Felidae_

    Elite Trainer

  • Felidae_

Before Guzma we had Lysandre and before Lysandre Pokemon Catcher without a coin flip.

 

Guzma is a great example of a good ulitiy supporter. You don't need any conditions to play him, nor are you bound to a specific type of Energy / Pokemon to benefit from him. He's versatile enough to be played in every deck, yet situational enough to almost never be run as a 4 off, no matter if you have access to VS Seeker or not.

 

What I really like about the card : he isn't used for the same reason in every match. Think of another utility supporter, lets say Team Flare Grunt. The reason to play the card is pretty obvious in every imaginable scenario. Now, if we talk about Guzma, the first thing that pops into our heads is to simply snipe a bench Pokemon. However, I frequently use Guzma to switch out my own Pokemon (maybe to avoid a revenge KO, or because I set up a Pokemon on my bench). I also use it to get rid of an active Pokemon with an annoying ability (Trevenant, Glaceon GX, Wobbuffet, etc.). You can also try to trap a high retreat Pokemon on your opponents side, or use it to attack multiple turns in a row with a card like Ho-Oh GX, etc.

 

But, without a doubt, the best thing about this card is that its mere presence changes the way we play the game. When your bench is vulnerable and can be targeted at any moment, you are going to plan your turns accordingly. The Pokemon TCG only has limited interactions between players, compared to other TCG/CCG games and a lot of the time it can feel as if two goldfish were playing against each other, since the majority of your actions are done in your own little bubble. Cards like N and Guzma force you to consider further actions from your opponent, as blindlessly running into them will often result in your demise.


The shadows of the abyss are like the petals of a monstrous flower that shall blossom within the skull and expand the mind beyond what any man can bear, but whether it decays under the earth or above on green fields, or out to sea or in the very air, all shall come to revelation, and to revel, in the knowledge of the strangling fruit - and the hand of the sinner shall rejoice, for there is no sin in shadow or in light that the seeds of the dead cannot forgive...

 

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04 November 2018 - 02:29 AM

#8

Ganonderp9001

    Rookie Trainer

  • Ganonderp9001

I absolutely hate Guzma, Lysandre, etc. I feel that an effect so powerful as sniping benched pokemon should be limited to pokemon's attacks and abilities themselves.

 

That said, I run either/or in every single deck I make due to how powerful they are. You are shooting yourself in the foot if you don't, and will constantly run into situations where you miss out on wins you would otherwise net. I do think this constrains deck building significantly.


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04 November 2018 - 02:47 PM

#9

Pokegen85

    Trainer

  • Pokegen85
I prefer Lysandre over Guzma. I’m a forgetful person to the degree that I’ll forget that Guzma forces me to switch my Pokémon as well. :(
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04 November 2018 - 06:14 PM

#10

Sakura150612

    Elite Trainer

  • Sakura150612

I absolutely hate Guzma, Lysandre, etc. I feel that an effect so powerful as sniping benched pokemon should be limited to pokemon's attacks and abilities themselves.

Interesting thoughts because because I had the exact opposite impression. Being a supporter, Guzma can be used by anyone and in any deck, leveling the playing field. If Guzma's and Lydandre's effect were restricted to pokemon abilities or attacks, only some specific decks would be able to use them, specially if the cards are Stage 1 or 2, and doubly so if they have a condition for activation that can only be fulfilled in specific decks.

 

So, being a supporter makes it more readily available, but it makes it available  equally to everyone .


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