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Moving from theme to standard - budget deck ideas, 1/3


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30 June 2018 - 10:29 PM

#1

Matan1

    Rookie Trainer

  • Matan1

So, you wanna try moving to standard. or maybe you have, and got beaten up by highly tuned decks full of powerful (and expensive) GX/EX cards. In short, this isn’t a simple task if you don’t want to lose as much. But with a little guidance, a tad of trading and making good use of theme deck cards, this can definitely be done.



first, some deck theory. decks in general can be split into 2 types: aggro (from aggressive) and control. one wins the game by being as aggressive as possible basically. the other wins by disrupting the game plan of the opponent until they collapse (or even deck out). let’s have a look at two cards and see:



Buzzwole GX, [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm4/57/"]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm4/57/[/url]

Spoiler




Vileplume, [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm3/6/"]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm3/6/[/url]



Spoiler




in case you missed it:



Spoiler




Let's have a quick self test. what about this one?



leafeon GX, [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm5/13/["]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm5/13/[/url]



Spoiler




and this?



alolan ninetales GX, [url="https://www.pokemon.com/uk/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm2/22/"]https://www.pokemon.com/uk/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm2/22/[/url]



Spoiler




ok. we learned something, I guess. let’s try building an aggro deck. aggro decks are generally built around top-notch attackers. what do we have at our disposal? our trusty garchomp of course, courtesy of mach strike.



well, no. I mean, sure. 100 damage is impressive by theme standards, but is actually pretty paltry by ‘standard’ standards. 200 is more impressive, but it’s not reliable. and with 150 HP, it can relatively easily get knocked out. and we need to get through 2 development stages to get there. standard plays attackers like buzzwole and defensive decks that can deal with buzzwole (or at least get knocked out trying). we should try harder.



but... this is basically theme's top attacker that we can rely on. ouch.



So... maybe we should try building a control deck. how does one build a control deck, anyway?



in pokemon tcg, control means denial of a resource needed to execute their own plan: like cards in hand, cards in deck, energy or active pokemon placement.



a card like this:



Team Flare Grunt, [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/xy/xy1/129/"]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/xy/xy1/129/[/url]



well, that looks straightforwards. no energy, no way to attack and we can slowly beat them up. the limitation of a single energy per turn can also really help us here. but first, we need to discuss a concept called “gameplan”. what is a “gameplan”?



in short, it’s how a mostly-ideal game will be played on your part, considering both sides got a fair hand and nobody’s having any really divine draws (“I plan on pulling this card, which I have a single one in my deck, every time”). it’s important for control and important for tweaking aggro too. everybody needs a gameplan: how does your board look like? your hand? your ability to respond to changes?



in the case of energy denial, our basic gameplan is simple:

  • Use precognitive aura to fetch an energy destruction card
  • shoot down one of their energies.
  • once they’ve exhausted their energy, finish them off

Simple, right? but we’re missing key components here. Which pokemon will be our active one, when all of this is happening? what’s stopping them from beating us while we try to shoot down their energy, by the time we can start precognitive aura’ing? how do we help this setup?



the solutions lie within another theme deck, Luminous frost.

Alolan Vulpix: [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm/sm2/21/"]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm/sm2/21/[/url]

Alolan Ninetales: [url="https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm3/28/"]https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-tcg/pokemon-cards/sm-series/sm3/28/[/url]



The Luminous barrier can accurately be described as one of the best friends of people having to fight decks filled with gobs and gobs of GX and EX not-so-pocket-anymore monsters. Now, it’s a weird place to find it in a theme deck, as theme decks have none of that to oppose. as if someone’s hinting that these should be used for standard instead. As an added bonus, Alolan Vulpix will help us get our combo up.



There we have it, “GarTales”. We do need to trade for energy destruction cards as well as other useful supporter staples, but we don’t need a single GX/EX pokemon for this to work. I’ve played a handful of games with it, it fares nicely as a budget deck. I’ve since built better budget decks which I’ll cover in future posts.



This deck has a major flaw though - it’s not so fun to play with and play against. You have to repeatedly aura and later lusamine until their resources are totally exhausted and only then strike. this can lead to very long games. as for the other player, energy destruction is really frustrating.



other than that, this deck is obviously extremely weak to decks running cards that can easily restore energy from the discard pile, as well as garbodor. you get what you pay for, eventually.



****** Pokémon Trading Card Game Deck List ******



##Pokémon - 22



* 1 Oranguru UPR 114

* 3 Gible UPR 96

* 2 Gabite UPR 98

* 3 Garchomp UPR 99

* 1 Gible FLI 60

* 3 Riolu UPR 66

* 1 Gabite FLI 61

* 3 Lucario UPR 67

* 3 Alolan Vulpix GRI 21

* 2 Alolan Ninetales BUS 28



##Trainer Cards - 29



* 2 Lusamine CIN 96

* 3 Professor's Letter XY 123

* 2 Team Skull Grunt SUM 133

* 4 Team Flare Grunt XY 129

* 3 Nest Ball SUM 123

* 4 Evosoda XY 116

* 4 Cynthia UPR 119

* 1 Field Blower GRI 125

* 2 Guzma BUS 115

* 1 Scorched Earth FCO 110

* 1 N FCO 105

* 2 Plumeria BUS 120



##Energy - 9



* 1 Water Energy XYEnergy 9

* 1 Splash Energy BKP 113

* 7 Fighting Energy BLWEnergy 3



Total Cards - 60



****** Deck List Generated by the Pokémon TCG Online www.pokemon.com/TCGO ******


Edited by Matan1, 30 June 2018 - 10:32 PM.

  • 0

01 July 2018 - 02:29 AM

#2

Mod_Jynthu

    Moderator

  • Mod_Jynthu

Hi Matan1,

 

Wow! I love how in-depth your post is and how you explain the strategy behind each of the cards you listed.

 

Thanks so much for sharing!


Moderator Jynthu
Pokémon TCG Online Moderator
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01 July 2018 - 03:06 AM

#3

Oldschool1990

    Veteran Trainer

  • Oldschool1990

Hey, just wanted to leave some advice how to improove your deck.^^

 

You can drop the Anti-GX Ninetales completely, those are useless because your opponent can just switch your mons with Guzma or Lycanrock. Go for 4 Garchomps instead.

Use rare candy instead of evosoda. Running 1 evosoda may be okay to get a Lucario up.

Cut the nest balls and the letters, 1-2 of each are enough. Run 4x double colorless energy.

Also, the grunts do nothing, replace them with special hammers, which don't take away your supporter slot that you need for more important functions.

 

Hope that could help somehow.

Keep it up. ;)


Edited by Oldschool1990, 01 July 2018 - 03:23 AM.

Specialized on Theme Deck Tournaments.
Latest theme deck analysis here:
http://forums.pokemontcg.com/topic/61913-analysis-of-the-competitive-theme-deck-format-may-2018/ 
Contra principia negantem non est disputandum.
  • 1

01 July 2018 - 03:51 AM

#4

Matan1

    Rookie Trainer

  • Matan1

Hey, just wanted to leave some advice how to improove your deck.^^

 

You can drop the Anti-GX Ninetales completely, those are useless because your opponent can just switch your mons with Guzma or Lycanrock. Go for 4 Garchomps instead.

Use rare candy instead of evosoda. Running 1 evosoda may be okay to get a Lucario up.

Cut the nest balls and the letters, 1-2 of each are enough. Run 4x double colorless energy.

Also, the grunts do nothing, replace them with special hammers, which don't take away your supporter slot that you need for more important functions.

 

Hope that could help somehow.

Keep it up. ;)

 

hey,

 

I dropped this design because I have better options and because it wasn't so fun to play (even for a 'control' player). you can quite possibly tune it better. the point was to make a budget deck that requires no noticeable investment in pricey GX cards. the experience from "GarTales" is the building foundation for the next improved decks.

 

but:

 

* if you pull a riolu (or a nest ball) when you have a garchomp/lucario on, next turn you bring another lucario and you can still keep aura'ing. the 2nd one is actually important to get card advantage and as backup.

* if garchomp plays wimp, they need to KO it with one hit with the guzma. doable, sure, but not nearly as easy for the opponent as when garchomp holds the active spot.

* I prefer evosoda to rare candy when there is more than one evolution train in general. in this deck, it is outright criticial.

* I play a lot of alolan ninetales, it's the inspiration for this series basically and one of the few impactful cards that can graduate from theme decks to standard. trust me on this one - it's crucial. you will see the next design steps.

* if you cut the grunts and your opponent doesn't play special lands, how are you going to deny them of energy? not only that, you don't really 'need' the other supporter once you have a combo out. having said that, it might be good to throw in at least 1 crushing hammer and/or 1 enhanced hammer, because that extra supporter could be a lusamine when you've run out of 'direct' supporter energy destruction. but... deck space is tight here: what will you take out, to put them in?


Edited by Matan1, 01 July 2018 - 04:08 AM.

  • -1

01 July 2018 - 06:33 AM

#5

BowserLuigi

    Elite Trainer

  • BowserLuigi

Garchomp/Lucario is probably the most widely used budget Standard deck.

 

* if you pull a riolu (or a nest ball) when you have a garchomp/lucario on, next turn you bring another lucario and you can still keep aura'ing. the 2nd one is actually important to get card advantage and as backup.

Nest ball is okay, but make sure you already run 4 ultra balls. Letters however are not so okay. For a deck like this I would run zero letters. 1 or 2 Energy lotto would be a better idea to fish for those Double Colorless Energy (include 4!).

 

* I prefer evosoda to rare candy when there is more than one evolution train in general. in this deck, it is outright criticial.

Running zero rare candies is just shooting yourself in the foot. You NEED Garchomp up ASAP to activate your Lucario. And you need it on YOUR turn. Ascension is only as a last-resort early-game if you somehow can't pull off a rare candy combo and it is really bad late-game. I'm not saying you should necessarily toss away all your evosodas, but.... you need those candies seriously. Almost all stage 2 decks (bar few exceptions like Greninja) do.

 

 

 

 

* I play a lot of alolan ninetales, it's the inspiration for this series basically and one of the few impactful cards that can graduate from theme decks to standard. trust me on this one - it's crucial. you will see the next design steps.

A9T is not usually included in Garchomp/Lucario not because of guzma (it still forces your opponent to DO something about it, which is the whole point of A9T), but because it requires a different energy type, and charging it up indirectly slows down your Garchomps which have OHKO potential. I would suggest removing the water and splash and just use 2 rainbows. If you read up on meta decklists, you'll see that baby A9T is only ever included in water decks (mostly with A9T GX as the main attacker). Running more than 1 type of basic energy is inconvenient, which is why only a few decks do it. If you want to, then go with the rainbows.

 

* if you cut the grunts and your opponent doesn't play special lands, how are you going to deny them of energy? not only that, you don't really 'need' the other supporter once you have a combo out. having said that, it might be good to throw in at least 1 crushing hammer and/or 1 enhanced hammer, because that extra supporter could be a lusamine when you've run out of 'direct' supporter energy destruction. but... deck space is tight here: what will you take out, to put them in?

Why not....don't deny energy at all? I believe this may be the reason why you feel inclined to include A9T in this deck. Look at how many energy denial you have. All these grunts and plumeria are cluttering up your deck making your setup horrendously slow and you feel inclined to slow down your opponent as well. But this is a newbie mistake that will prove costly in the long run. Focus on getting your own board setup. Garchomp isn't meant to disrupt like say Sylveon GX (play this if you really want to annoy your opponents). It's meant to destroy. You CAN play 1 or 2 enhanced hammers if you really wanted to, because DCE is popular, but please refrain from including random grunts in every deck. You'll be glad if you do.

 

All these grunts are useless late-game because any turn you use a grunt, you can't use Cynthia. And you need Cynthia for Garchomp to reach OHKO potential. You also need a crucial card: Choice Band. Without it, you'll fail to OHKO some stage 1 GXes. A9T also benefits greatly from Choice Band, allowing her to 2HKO most stage 1 GXes. To recycle Cynthias, you should use the item card Pal Pad, which shuffles 2 supporters (ideally Cynthias) into your deck, and not Lusamine. You can fish them out with Lucario. Many lists include 2 Pal Pad.

 

Also eventually you'll eventually want to upgrade your dragon Gible line to the fighting type one from Forbidden Light. The fighting Garchomp is superior because you can boost its damage with Diancie Prism Star from the same set. It can also hit for weakness (which the dragon type cannot do in standard), most notably OHKOing Zoroark GX without needing a Cynthia (which is one of the few reasons why you even want a Guzma in this deck at all). Finally, it can use Strong Energy, boosting its damage even further.

 

With one strong energy, choice band and diancie prism star on the bench, Royal Blades hits for 170 damage on GXes without Cynthia. That is enough damage for you to Guzma out a Lele and take it out. You probably don't want more than 1 Guzma, since 170 still fails to OHKO a lot of GX threats. But 1 can be clutch sometimes and you can recycle with pal pad if needed. However post-rotation Garchomp will lose Strong Energy, and will no longer be able to OHKO Lele, so Guzma will really be just for Zoroark GX.

 

The 'beginner' Garchomp/Lucario decklist would look something like this, made from cards mostly available from theme decks. I say beginner cuz this decklist has plenty of improvements to make, but the 'optimal' build would require quite a bit more investment.

 

****** Pokémon Trading Card Game Deck List ******
 
##Pokémon - 16
 
* 1 Oranguru SUM 113
* 4 Gible UPR 96
* 3 Gabite UPR 98
* 4 Garchomp UPR 99
* 2 Riolu UPR 66
* 2 Lucario UPR 67
 
##Trainer Cards - 34
 
* 3 Professor Sycamore STS 114
* 2 Evosoda GEN 62
* 3 Choice Band GRI 121
* 2 Pal Pad UPR 132
* 2 Super Rod BKT 149
* 2 Nest Ball SUM 123
* 1 Special Charge STS 105
* 4 Cynthia UPR 119
* 1 Town Map BKT 150
* 4 Ultra Ball SUM 135
* 2 N NVI 101
* 4 Rare Candy SUM 129
* 1 Field Blower GRI 125
* 3 Float Stone BKT 137
 
##Energy - 10
 
* 4 Double Colorless Energy FCO 114
* 6 Fighting Energy Energy 6
 
Total Cards - 60
 
****** Deck List Generated by the Pokémon TCG Online www.pokemon.com/TCGO ******

Edited by BowserLuigi, 01 July 2018 - 06:42 AM.

  • 1

01 July 2018 - 08:42 AM

#6

Matan1

    Rookie Trainer

  • Matan1

Garchomp/Lucario is probably the most widely used budget Standard deck.


that's correct. doesn't make it a gospel (or a prudent choice) to go aggro with it.

in fact, it's trying to out-aggro an already overly competitive environment.

what makes you think you can outrun a buzzwole deck in aggro?

or alternatively, punch through a deck that is already designed to withstand a harsher beating?




 

Nest ball is okay, but make sure you already run 4 ultra balls. Letters however are not so okay. For a deck like this I would run zero letters. 1 or 2 Energy lotto would be a better idea to fish for those Double Colorless Energy (include 4!).


Perhaps. Energy is not as important in this deck, rather than getting the combo out there.
Professor's letter is a lot more consistent than EL.
Keep in mind that this deck can function quite well with zero energy, up until it needs it.


 

Running zero rare candies is just shooting yourself in the foot. You NEED Garchomp up ASAP to activate your Lucario. And you need it on YOUR turn. Ascension is only as a last-resort early-game if you somehow can't pull off a rare candy combo and it is really bad late-game. I'm not saying you should necessarily toss away all your evosodas, but.... you need those candies seriously. Almost all stage 2 decks (bar few exceptions like Greninja) do.


A garchomp without a matching lucario is pretty much useless in this deck. it goes both ways.




 

A9T is not usually included in Garchomp/Lucario not because of guzma (it still forces your opponent to DO something about it, which is the whole point of A9T), but because it requires a different energy type, and charging it up indirectly slows down your Garchomps which have OHKO potential. I would suggest removing the water and splash and just use 2 rainbows. If you read up on meta decklists, you'll see that baby A9T is only ever included in water decks (mostly with A9T GX as the main attacker). Running more than 1 type of basic energy is inconvenient, which is why only a few decks do it. If you want to, then go with the rainbows.



Why not....don't deny energy at all? I believe this may be the reason why you feel inclined to include A9T in this deck. Look at how many energy denial you have. All these grunts and plumeria are cluttering up your deck making your setup horrendously slow and you feel inclined to slow down your opponent as well. But this is a newbie mistake that will prove costly in the long run. Focus on getting your own board setup. Garchomp isn't meant to disrupt like say Sylveon GX (play this if you really want to annoy your opponents). It's meant to destroy. You CAN play 1 or 2 enhanced hammers if you really wanted to, because DCE is popular, but please refrain from including random grunts in every deck. You'll be glad if you do.


Not all control designs rely on energy denial. this is an energy denial control deck. for several reasons:

* it's affordable without buying into a single EX/GX

* there are quite a few decks which are very weak to it because they run few energies

* it can function without energy requirements



it's a design choice and a particular type of deck.

as such, Baby A9T is the perfect match for it.
Another strict design choice was to (re)use cards from theme decks, as much as possible

as such, a set of 4 grunts is ideal for this gameplan. it's not random.
it's wholistic design. that's also why it sports 2 plumeria.
I wouldn't use plumeria in decks that aren't strictly about energy denial.
 

All these grunts are useless late-game because any turn you use a grunt, you can't use Cynthia. And you need Cynthia for Garchomp to reach OHKO potential. You also need a crucial card: Choice Band. Without it, you'll fail to OHKO some stage 1 GXes. A9T also benefits greatly from Choice Band, allowing her to 2HKO most stage 1 GXes. To recycle Cynthias, you should use the item card Pal Pad, which shuffles 2 supporters (ideally Cynthias) into your deck, and not Lusamine. You can fish them out with Lucario. Many lists include 2 Pal Pad.


If we survived to this level of late game, it's already some kind of success.

indeed, late-game is usually endless plumeria with resource management or lusamine-ing it.

by late-game with more than half their energy in the discard pile, they stop landing one each turn.

I can bear that burden. by this stage I should be aura'ing and not relying on draw.

Lusamine does NOT recycle cynthia in this deck. Lusamine recycles plumeria or TSG.

 

Also eventually you'll eventually want to upgrade your dragon Gible line to the fighting type one from Forbidden Light. The fighting Garchomp is superior because you can boost its damage with Diancie Prism Star from the same set. It can also hit for weakness (which the dragon type cannot do in standard), most notably OHKOing Zoroark GX without needing a Cynthia (which is one of the few reasons why you even want a Guzma in this deck at all). Finally, it can use Strong Energy, boosting its damage even further.



With one strong energy, choice band and diancie prism star on the bench, Royal Blades hits for 170 damage on GXes without Cynthia. That is enough damage for you to Guzma out a Lele and take it out. You probably don't want more than 1 Guzma, since 170 still fails to OHKO a lot of GX threats. But 1 can be clutch sometimes and you can recycle with pal pad if needed. However post-rotation Garchomp will lose Strong Energy, and will no longer be able to OHKO Lele, so Guzma will really be just for Zoroark GX.



The 'beginner' Garchomp/Lucario decklist would look something like this, made from cards mostly available from theme decks. I say beginner cuz this decklist has plenty of improvements to make, but the 'optimal' build would require quite a bit more investment.


ICYMI this is NOT a regular garchomp/lucario build, it has an entirely different gameplan.

the fact that they share those cards don't mean these are not two radically different creations.

Ideally, this deck doesn't land a single punch before all their energy is in their discard pile.

Usually they concede before that happens anyway. any damage output increase is immaterial.

are you sure you understand how this particular deck operates / its gameplan?

Edited by Matan1, 01 July 2018 - 10:15 AM.

  • 0

01 July 2018 - 11:30 AM

#7

BowserLuigi

    Elite Trainer

  • BowserLuigi

that's correct. doesn't make it a gospel (or a prudent choice) to go aggro with it.

in fact, it's trying to out-aggro an already overly competitive environment.

what makes you think you can outrun a buzzwole deck in aggro?

or alternatively, punch through a deck that is already designed to withstand a harsher beating?




 

Perhaps. Energy is not as important in this deck, rather than getting the combo out there.
Professor's letter is a lot more consistent than EL.
Keep in mind that this deck can function quite well with zero energy, up until it needs it.


 

A garchomp without a matching lucario is pretty much useless in this deck. it goes both ways.




 

Not all control designs rely on energy denial. this is an energy denial control deck. for several reasons:

* it's affordable without buying into a single EX/GX

* there are quite a few decks which are very weak to it because they run few energies

* it can function without energy requirements



it's a design choice and a particular type of deck.

as such, Baby A9T is the perfect match for it.
Another strict design choice was to (re)use cards from theme decks, as much as possible

as such, a set of 4 grunts is ideal for this gameplan. it's not random.
it's wholistic design. that's also why it sports 2 plumeria.
I wouldn't use plumeria in decks that aren't strictly about energy denial.
 

If we survived to this level of late game, it's already some kind of success.

indeed, late-game is usually endless plumeria with resource management or lusamine-ing it.

by late-game with more than half their energy in the discard pile, they stop landing one each turn.

I can bear that burden. by this stage I should be aura'ing and not relying on draw.

Lusamine does NOT recycle cynthia in this deck. Lusamine recycles plumeria or TSG.

 

ICYMI this is NOT a regular garchomp/lucario build, it has an entirely different gameplan.

the fact that they share those cards don't mean these are not two radically different creations.

Ideally, this deck doesn't land a single punch before all their energy is in their discard pile.

Usually they concede before that happens anyway. any damage output increase is immaterial.

are you sure you understand how this particular deck operates / its gameplan?

Buzzvole plays 4 max elixirs, and usually has a healthy amount of energy. Also expect their Diancie to go up in the first couple turns. The GX can OHKO Gible with 1 Strong or Diancie, and OHKO Riolu with 1 Strong and 1 Diancie. It can also slap a benched Gible or Riolu making it susceptible to future Jet Punches. I fail to see how would it fare any better against Buzzvole.

 

Notice that you can only ever discard one energy at a time. That's not good even if you somehow play a grunt/plumeria every turn. If you look at other stall decks like Sylveon or Wailord, you'll see that they have plenty of hammers as well. They can potentially discard more than one energy per turn. And they have high HP and max potions/acerola/AZ making them extremely hard to kill even if you do have energy.

 

Honestly control decks are one archetype that I advise newbies not to go into so quickly. They are NOT easy to play. And Garchomp/Lucario is just inferior to Sylveon GX as a control deck anyway. Newbs should just familiarize themselves with typical aggro decks first, as the majority of decks out there are like that. 

 

Are you sure it actually works against most meta decks?

 

Hats off to you though for thinking of something unusual. But the reason I'm skeptical is that this deck's structure looks very similar to a typical one used by newbies. Lots of grunts, letters and other stuff that you typically don't find in a garchomp/lucario deck, but are quite common in generic newbie decks. And no they don't work well at all. Yes I initially thought you're trying to build just another garchomp/lucario. Well, I apologize for misunderstanding you. I just don't feel that this deck is that effective.


Edited by BowserLuigi, 01 July 2018 - 11:35 AM.

  • 1

01 July 2018 - 12:00 PM

#8

Matan1

    Rookie Trainer

  • Matan1

Buzzvole plays 4 max elixirs, and usually has a healthy amount of energy. Also expect their Diancie to go up in the first couple turns. The GX can OHKO Gible with 1 Strong or Diancie, and OHKO Riolu with 1 Strong and 1 Diancie. It can also slap a benched Gible or Riolu making it susceptible to future Jet Punches. I fail to see how would it fare any better against Buzzvole.
 
Notice that you can only ever discard one energy at a time. That's not good even if you somehow play a grunt/plumeria every turn. If you look at other stall decks like Sylveon or Wailord, you'll see that they have plenty of hammers as well. They can potentially discard more than one energy per turn. And they have high HP and max potions/acerola/AZ making them extremely hard to kill even if you do have energy.
 
Honestly control decks are one archetype that I advise newbies not to go into so quickly. They are NOT easy to play. And Garchomp/Lucario is just inferior to Sylveon GX as a control deck anyway. Newbs should just familiarize themselves with typical aggro decks first, as the majority of decks out there are like that. 
 
Are you sure it actually works against most meta decks?
 
Hats off to you though for thinking of something unusual. But the reason I'm skeptical is that this deck's structure looks very similar to a typical one used by newbies. Lots of grunts, letters and other stuff that you typically don't find in a garchomp/lucario deck, but are quite common in generic newbie decks. And no they don't work well at all. Yes I initially thought you're trying to build just another garchomp/lucario. Well, I apologize for misunderstanding you. I just don't feel that this deck is that effective.


Most builds I've seen have 8-9 Energy.
But I digress - this is a budget deck with 0 EX/GX cards, almost entirely made of theme deck parts.
it's most definitely not supposed or able to consistently beat buzzwole...

I totally agree about control decks being much harder to pilot than aggro and about inferiority to sylveon GX control.
Heck, Hoopa SLG would fit a lot better in - but these all need to be traded for.

I played with it only for a while before moving onwards, but it felt a lot better than garchomp aggro.

Edited by Matan1, 01 July 2018 - 12:02 PM.

  • 0

02 July 2018 - 11:20 AM

#9

Mod_Jynthu

    Moderator

  • Mod_Jynthu

Hello Trainers,

 

Please remember to be respectful to other players in all posts. I recommend checking out the forum rules if you have not already, or recently.

 

Thanks!


Moderator Jynthu
Pokémon TCG Online Moderator
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