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OU7C4ST - Recent Card Value Guide Changes


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31 May 2018 - 09:16 PM

#1

OU7C4ST

    Senior Trainer

  • OU7C4ST

Hi all!

Last night I added Forbidden Light values along with changing up the Pack values as the ratios haven't been adjusted in awhile. (Everything older than FL still needs updated, which is happening Saturday)

It's been brought to my attention that not everyone agrees with my posted values on Pack Ratios, ( which is totally cool! :) ) so I would like to hear your input on them as well if possible.

Tell me which ones you believe I got right, which ones I got totally wrong, and so on. Include detailed information on why you think your suggested ratios may be more accurate.

This only helps bring more accuracy to the Card Value Guide.

Thanks in advance & happy gaming!


OU7C4ST - /r/ptcgo Head Moderator
Twitch's #1 PTCGO Streamer
Founder of OU7C4ST's Card Value Guide

Check out my YT for Deck Reviews, & More!

  • 2

31 May 2018 - 09:25 PM

#2

Princess_Aurora

    Veteran Trainer

  • Princess_Aurora
Hey! I think that Glaceon-EX’s value is 0.66 and it’s Full Art version is at 1.5. (Fates Collide)

According to discussion threads that I have read, Tropical Beach 2011 is about 160 value, and Tropical Beach 2012 is about 150.

Battle City (Black Star Promo) will probably be at 1 value, but offer/demand rate is rather small so I can’t say for sure.

That’s all that I think I know. Good luck with your guide!

Friendship is magic!

  • 1

31 May 2018 - 11:19 PM

#3

PlatinumDude

    Veteran Trainer

  • PlatinumDude

Thanks for the update. I still remember the time when people offered a regular art Ultra Necrozma for 19-20 Guardians Rising packs (an arm and a leg for one of Forbidden Light's best chase cards). I'm glad that the price went down by a lot since then.


  • 1

03 June 2018 - 09:01 AM

#4

Frankie-Ashley

    Trainer

  • Frankie-Ashley

Wouldnt know where to start tbh and very suprised people actually take your word as gospel...

You just reducing prices of everything for no reason  few i agree with like shining legends price reduction, everything else is just a no no.

reducing leles price (when she is used as currency)... and not reducing guardian risings price when she is the reason GRI is valued at 1 is just beyond me.... but either way im out have fun and good luck


Edited by Frankie-Ashley, 03 June 2018 - 09:10 AM.

  • -1

03 June 2018 - 10:25 AM

#5

T3muj1n7

    Trainer

  • T3muj1n7
Can you suggest an alternative? In the interest of the community having a rough guide is beneficial, as not all players have the time or capacity to make their own judgement.

Inevitably some will lose out, but simply complaining that you dislike it is unproductive. Judging by your avatar you can afford the tax on your cards, whereas a newer player has to know that they are getting a fair deal.

I dislike that plasma freeze was lowered, because this impacts my own wealth, however it matches my personal observation, so I accept it.

I'd like to see COL energies updated soon, as people tend to hold on to cards where there is uncertainty, for fear of getting a bad deal. These seem to range between 3 for lightning to 7 for fighting, with the rest falling somewhere in between.

TL;DR keep up the good work, I'd hate to see this disappear as the vocal minority skews your perception. This is an invaluable resource.
  • 2

04 June 2018 - 06:48 AM

#6

OU7C4ST

    Senior Trainer

  • OU7C4ST

Can you suggest an alternative? In the interest of the community having a rough guide is beneficial, as not all players have the time or capacity to make their own judgement.

Inevitably some will lose out, but simply complaining that you dislike it is unproductive. Judging by your avatar you can afford the tax on your cards, whereas a newer player has to know that they are getting a fair deal.

I dislike that plasma freeze was lowered, because this impacts my own wealth, however it matches my personal observation, so I accept it.

I'd like to see COL energies updated soon, as people tend to hold on to cards where there is uncertainty, for fear of getting a bad deal. These seem to range between 3 for lightning to 7 for fighting, with the rest falling somewhere in between.

TL;DR keep up the good work, I'd hate to see this disappear as the vocal minority skews your perception. This is an invaluable resource.

Frankie-Ashley has spend several opportunities to bash me, or the guide for months, Year + now without much reasoning, or proof of reason for doing so except it may hurt his/her own self gain from trading. The reasonings the user has listed above are already contradicting as I stream myself researching the values, and posting them. They don't come out of thin air as they so truly believe, lol.

I don't really spend much time on people who just like to argue for the sake of it, even when you lay out in front of them why they are obviously wrong. Just not worth lowering oneself to that type of negativity level. :)

Thanks for the kind words! CoL is gonna be analyzed soon. I'm looking to get a few more myself. I just don't like the SR's over the CoL holos.


OU7C4ST - /r/ptcgo Head Moderator
Twitch's #1 PTCGO Streamer
Founder of OU7C4ST's Card Value Guide

Check out my YT for Deck Reviews, & More!

  • -1

06 June 2018 - 07:57 PM

#7

Player_Jay

    Veteran Trainer

  • Player_Jay
I feel Forbidden Light is still even to Guardian Rising.

The majority of cards you get from Guardian Rising are valued under 1 pack.

There are only a couple cards in GR which can return you 1 pack or more in value.

Tapu Lele is a great card, but how many times will you get it in pack opening?

I have opened over 30 GR packs.

I haven’t gotten a single Tapu Lele.

The cards I am getting are valued under 1 pack.

I’m really not getting any return.

Yet, Guardian Rising is valued at 1.

When you look at Forbidden Light pack, you have it valued at 0.75.

If you look at all the GX & Cards which come from FL, you have them all valued at 1 pack or more.

I only saw like 1-2 under 1 pack in value.

The pack as a whole has multiple cards returning the pack you opened.

For these reason, I think Forbidden Light should be valued higher than 0.75.

To me, I think it should be around 0.90 or even 1 pack even.

Edited by Player_Jay, 06 June 2018 - 07:58 PM.

It is said that if Gengar is hiding, it cools the area by nearly 10 degrees Fahrenheit.
  • 0

07 June 2018 - 09:28 AM

#8

goodgoy

    Rookie Trainer

  • goodgoy

Guardians Rising is more than 1.0 now. 

 

It is not that UB and Leles are dropping, but that GRI is increasing. Please correct this.


  • 0

08 June 2018 - 02:48 AM

#9

Frankie-Ashley

    Trainer

  • Frankie-Ashley
Ok... well i dont really play anymore because of people taking a guide as a bible... and im bored of it lol.
But yes... its not bashing if someone ask for an opinion ill give it... and tbh it dont affect my wealth in the game.

But what bothers me is the fact that if everyone is selling lele at 23 and people offer 22 for a lele.... you seem to change your guide to 22... so then people start to lower it again and then you will lower its value and so on...
also if gri and lele are both used as say currency then why lower lele..

And tbh please do enlighten me as to why cards are lowered in price? For what valid reason/s?
  • 1

08 June 2018 - 03:44 AM

#10

RobRatt

    Elite Trainer

  • RobRatt

<snip>

But what bothers me is the fact that if everyone is selling lele at 23 and people offer 22 for a lele.... you seem to change your guide to 22... so then people start to lower it again and then you will lower its value and so on...

 

<snip>

 

And tbh please do enlighten me as to why cards are lowered in price? For what valid reason/s?

In his defense, Frankie-Ashley has brought up a couple important points about the value of cards constantly spiraling down.  He's not the only one who's noticed this, or brought their concerns to the forum.  There does seem to be a trend, and no one should get a free pass, even if they provide a useful resource.  We're all fallible.

 

Maybe these things shouldn't be dismissed summarily?

 

Is it the chicken or the egg?  Are prices going down, and the guide following suit?  Or is the guide looking at narrow factors (e.g. only people's offers), adjusting downward, which causes players to offer lower next time?

 

Seem like valid questions to me.  I don't see fault in him asking for this discussion.


Edited by RobRatt, 08 June 2018 - 03:52 AM.

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08 June 2018 - 04:32 AM

#11

abinhathbour456

    Elite Trainer

  • abinhathbour456

well if I can put my point of view and how I see this when he wants a card after a few days he will lower the card value as what will happen with the col energies since he wants them and after that I assume the value will spike but in the end thats just my point of view nothing else because there is a pattern and public trades are prove of what am talking about.


Member Of Top Cut And Director Of Trades.

http://forums.pokemontcg.com/topic/25163-the-top-cut-trading-inc-2-ultra-prism-added/

owner of guru cave trading co. come check it out

http://forums.pokemontcg.com/topic/45628-the-guru-cave-trading-co-gctc-back-in-business/page-1

  • 2

08 June 2018 - 05:35 AM

#12

Zendoku

    Rookie Trainer

  • Zendoku

Thank you for creating the website. As a new player who is interested in trading, it is really helpful to get an estimate ! :)
 

Hi all!

Last night I added Forbidden Light values along with changing up the Pack values as the ratios haven't been adjusted in awhile. (Everything older than FL still needs updated, which is happening Saturday)

It's been brought to my attention that not everyone agrees with my posted values on Pack Ratios, ( which is totally cool! :) ) so I would like to hear your input on them as well if possible.

Tell me which ones you believe I got right, which ones I got totally wrong, and so on. Include detailed information on why you think your suggested ratios may be more accurate.

This only helps bring more accuracy to the Card Value Guide.

Thanks in advance & happy gaming!


  • 0

12 June 2018 - 01:12 AM

#13

draczod

    Rookie Trainer

  • draczod

I like having a reference so thank you very much for that. Combining it with what you see from Public Offers is helpful to see if you're getting totally ripped off by a swindler who pulls an online version of the old movie mewtwo trick on some unsuspecting noob like myself.

Also, before the Forbidden Light values came out it was kind of a wild west. I certainly had no way of basing the value of Naganadel-GX other than comparing to the real cards values.

Personally, I would be most comfortable if they were tied more transparently in some way or fraction to the values of the actual cards. Of course that's only if everyone can agree with the values set by whatever authority or vendor that happens to be.

Thanks again for the time you put in!

 

Additionally, it would be helpful if the developers made trade data available.


Edited by draczod, 12 June 2018 - 01:16 AM.

  • 1

12 June 2018 - 04:27 PM

#14

Jigglypuffan

    Elite Trainer

  • Jigglypuffan

Additionally, it would be helpful if the developers made trade data available.

 

agree


  • 1

20 June 2018 - 07:07 PM

#15

Frankie-Ashley

    Trainer

  • Frankie-Ashley

Oh so its been 12days since i replied amd 2 very respectful people also spoke up and no reply back.... [Edited by Mod_Turtle: Please keep replies friendly & constructive]


  • 0

28 June 2018 - 04:45 AM

#16

OU7C4ST

    Senior Trainer

  • OU7C4ST

Oh so its been 12days since i replied amd 2 very respectful people also spoke up and no reply back.... [Edited by Mod_Turtle: Please keep replies friendly & constructive]

I don't go on here religiously. I partake in a more open-free social media platform that doesn't have as many censorship restrictions. Also, some users here should show a bit more of maturity. Name calling is pretty elementary. Have some self-respect, and able to keep an adult conversation please. You only embarrass yourself when acting in such childish ways. Don't look for pity, look for respect.

Regarding the Card Value Guide, it's been updated about a week ago. Currently this weekend is the next update which already needs quite a few things changed again.

The guide's complete value sheet is based on a 1:1 value, which I've placed GRI at 1.0, and adjusted all cards accordingly. If you would like to see the live-updates so you can understand that the Guide is based on current trends, and not setting the trends itself, you can sift through my recent VoDs on my primary streaming platform. It's all available for viewing. It has much input from the community, as it does showcasing current market value for cards.


On a personal note, the name-bashing, and complete lack of respect shown to somebody who has always been transparent with the community on several different social media platforms, users such as Frankie-Ashley, etc. have literally zero reason to be disgusting towards other players where they have no reason to be. I think you should do more self-reflecting, and find more zen within yourself to not be so hateful if you want my opinion. You have a concern with something I do? Bring it up nicely, and professionally, & I'll be more than happy to discuss with you of your concerns in a respectable conversation like I do with about 99% of the rest of the community.

Don't like my guide, you are free to not use it, along with it being freely available to be used by the community.

There are also several areas on the guide that states it's the not "end-all-be-all" of PTCGO prices, but just a guide. Along with several statements that public trades should always be cross-referenced as well. Those 2 things have been on the guide since it's creation almost. That isn't anything new.

If you are unable to differentiate between what the Card Value Guide states itself that it's only a guide, and the players who refuse to read that part, and treat it as a "bible", then that's just plain idiocy. It's almost as if I say water is wet on my guide, and some users say water is dry, you are blaming me for those users doing so. Let's be real, and find actual issues to have here. You can not blame me for some of the playerbase's refusal to take my warnings, and statements as well as the prices listed.


Thanks for your time.


OU7C4ST - /r/ptcgo Head Moderator
Twitch's #1 PTCGO Streamer
Founder of OU7C4ST's Card Value Guide

Check out my YT for Deck Reviews, & More!

  • -1

29 June 2018 - 05:40 AM

#17

RobRatt

    Elite Trainer

  • RobRatt

Courtesy of the Internet Archive (Wayback Machine), I've looked carefully at the last several price updates and changes.
 
Using the following dates, from last August to the current version:  8/7/2017, 9/2/2017, 10/2/2017, 11/1/2017, 12/4/2017, 1/1/2018, 2/2/2018, 3/2/2018, 3/17/2018, 4/5/2018, 4/23/2018, 5/7/2018, 5/14/2018, 6/20/2018
 
Here's the history of Tapu Lele GX for the last several months:
 
Tapu Lele (RA) = 23 > 27 > 27 > 24 > 24 > 24 > 23.5 > 23.5 > 23.5 > 23.5 > 23.5 > 23.5 > 23 > 19
 
Tapu Lele (FA) = 26 > 29.75 > 29.75 > 27.5 > 27.5 > 27 > 26 > 26 > 26 > 26.5 > 26.5 > 26.5 > 25.5 > 21.75
 
Tapu Lele (SR) = 40 > 45.5 > 45.5 > 39.5 > 39.5 > 34 > 32.5 > 32.5 > 32.5 > 31 > 31 > 31 > 29 > 24

EDIT:  Keep in mind, Tapu Lele GX had been out for six months (by Aug 2017), so these would be considered "stable" prices.  That is, until the Price Guide dropped rapidly with that last updates (shown in Red).
 

The guide's complete value sheet is based on a 1:1 value, which I've placed GRI at 1.0, and adjusted all cards accordingly. If you would like to see the live-updates so you can understand that the Guide is based on current trends, and not setting the trends itself, you can sift through my recent VoDs on my primary streaming platform. It's all available for viewing. It has much input from the community, as it does showcasing current market value for cards.

IMHO, re-adjusting the market (for everybody) is way above your pay grade.
 
Tapu Lele GX is a perfect example of why I'm questioning many of the forced changes in the market, especially since Guardians Rising is only considered the "standard currency" because of it.  There's no logical reason that it's "tanking" -- other than the price guide.  And where we could always count on certain cards holding their value (steady, like a rock), that has been corrupted.
 
It seems to be this way across the board, with many of the cards that players (in particular, traders) consider staples of the game (both old and new cards).  The last few updates are forcing prices downward, intentionally it appears, and I can't find anyone who can explain why.
 
In the last updates:
 
Zorark RA went from a steady 7 to 5.5
Zorark FA went from a steady 7.5 to 5.75
Zorark RR went from a steady 12 to 9.5

 
Buzzwole RA went from 12.5 to 10
Buzzwole FA went from 15.5 to 12
Buzzwole RR went from 17.75 to 14

 
Ultra Ball SUM went from a steady 34.5, to 30. and now 27
 
Ultra Ball PLF went from 120 to 88 in less than a month
 
What am I missing?  Did Buzzwole and Zoroark quit being the two best meta-cards in the game?
 
It's not just these cards that concern me.  Like I said, it's this way with too many of them.  Will the spiral downward end?
 
In full disclosure, I'm the player who contacted Ou7c4st privately, which (very likely) prompted this thread a couple hours later.  On that date, I didn't agree (and still don't) that ALL XY-era packs were relegated to garbage status.  This makes it much harder for newer players who don't always have a stock of Guardians Rising packs.  In one day, almost all of them went to 0.33, which meant, for example, that Roaring Skies lost 50% value on a whim.
 
I'm not a profit trader.  Anyone who knows me can testify to that.  But with all the Trading Companies gone, I can't help but notice the market being unduly influenced.
 
I'll still recommend that new players use it as a resource, but honestly, I'm not entirely sure for how much longer.


Edited by RobRatt, 04 July 2018 - 07:05 PM.

  • 4

30 June 2018 - 01:17 AM

#18

Player_Jay

    Veteran Trainer

  • Player_Jay

Snip

What am I missing?

Snip

It's not just these cards that concern me. Like I said, it's this way with too many of them. Will the spiral downward end?

Snip

The answers you seek are ones that only accountants can answer.

“What am I missing?”

What you are missing is an accounting terminology known as Depreciation.
Depreciation is the reduction in value of an asset with the passage of time, due particularly to wear & tear.

Accounts put shelf lives on all things.
All things have a life expectancy.
Once, you reach the life expectancy the object is considered used up/trash.

Example:
You buy a car for 10,000
The car has life expectancy of 10 years.
In 10 years, the car you bought on average is going to be broken down/unusable.
You are than going to have to buy new car to replace it.

What the Accountants do is account/interpret this process with Depreciation.
The easiest Depreciation method is the straight line method.
You take the price you payed for the car (10,000).
Than you divide it by the life expectancy of the car (10).
The result is 1,000.
Every year for 10 years the car you bought is going to reduce by 1,000.

Year 1 - 10,000
Year 2 - 9,000
Year 3 - 8,000

On a chart, it is a slow gradual decline.

The problem people have is trying to apply the above situation in a virtual world.
It’s easy to understand a car getting wear & tear.
The Sun hitting on it.
The Rain hitting on it.

The problem is pixels don’t get wear & tear by the surrounding environment.
What happens is a wear & tear has to be placed upon them!
It is generally done with restrictions!
PTCG places restrictions in the game which give the cards a sort of Depreciation.
The way PTCG does this is by having a Format.
The game is broken down into different Formats:
-Standard
-Expanded
-Unlimited

A virtual cards highest value should be in Standard.
It comes out as new card playable in Standard.
The card matures.
It has period where it increases in value.
It reaches it peak value.
Than it declines in a gradual decline.

Than people say why does it decline?
It declines because the card doesn’t stay in Standard forever?
It has a Standard Life Expectancy.
It will eventually rotate out of Standard.

Sadly, It will not stay forever because of a restriction placed upon it by PTCG.
You can see the above process I mentioned in your figures.

Tapu Lele (RA) Comes out at 23, Peaks at 27, Gradual Decline until it rotates out.

The only real argument that can be made is towards the end.
Most times you do a gradual consistent reduction.
23 > 19 is a slight spike downward, but it depends on how Outcast does it.
It could be right.

————————————————————————————————

To answer your last question:

“Will the spiral downward end?”

Yes! It will end when the value of the card reaches 0.
Than it will flat line at 0.

Edited by Player_Jay, 30 June 2018 - 01:20 AM.

It is said that if Gengar is hiding, it cools the area by nearly 10 degrees Fahrenheit.
  • 0

30 June 2018 - 03:30 AM

#19

RobRatt

    Elite Trainer

  • RobRatt

The answers you seek are ones that only accountants can answer.

@Player_Jay, that was a very long answer that doesn't pertain to the problem.  Sorry if my use of rhetorical questions was confusing.
 
Thanks for taking the time though.


Edited by RobRatt, 30 June 2018 - 10:28 PM.

  • 0

30 June 2018 - 11:33 AM

#20

dragos597

    Novice Trainer

  • dragos597

Not sure what are you thinking when reducing the value of all cards while pack price remain the same, reducing value of cards when it is a 3 of in every deck like guzma. For example, when tapu lele gx price reduce, GR remains unchanged when it is the card that make GR that valuable in the 1st place. Which means there is virtually no reason for anyone to open a pack since it has the most value. Opening 19 packs to get a lele would most likely not give you one. The way you manipulate price is very interesting, the introduction of permanent old packs in in game shop reduces the price of old cards by a lot. While I do agree their value should be reduce, they should not take such a big hit. You never take into account that people have to use their coins to get those pack when they could be saving for a new expansion. I hope you close down the website as it is not helping old players causing many to quit/


Edited by dragos597, 30 June 2018 - 11:35 AM.

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